[UK] London - Can you recommend some areas?

Hi guys,

I am wondering if anyone here has some experience living in London and whether you could share your experience to help us narrow down our search.
We are potentially considering moving to London and are trying at this stage to determine what areas of London could suit us.
We are looking for the following attributes:

- Safe
- Family friendly (one kid now, a second hopefully soon)
- Good schools
- A multicultural population (our kids are mixed race)
- Decent transport to central London
- Overall pleasant

To give you an idea - if you live in Sydney - perhaps something with a feel similar to the lower north shore but not the uber expensive areas like Mosman, Northbridge etc, more the Lane coves and Artarmons.

It has been really challenging trying to determine which areas of London have the attributes we are after. Of course, nothing beats being on the ground, but at this early stage having an idea of where to look allows us to then run some numbers, checking what is available etc.

Thanks guys

 

Budget?

 

Work location (docklands and west end are very different) and acceptavle commute time?

 

Work location is unknown yet, but around the city more or less most likely commute under an hour, preferably 45min or less.

Budget is flexible depending on location and dwelling type (house, flat etc.) we would start by renting for maybe a year or so anyway before committing - most important factor is the area, so we would be willing to compromise in part in terms of dwelling type or size for the right area.

 

Anything near the cross rail.

 

I lived in London for a long time. Work around the train lines first. Not just the tube but get a map of the overground trains as well and work out what your commute time would be and how easy/hard it would be. If you work in the city you can't drive to work in London therefore being close to a train line (within a 10 min walk) which doesn't involve too much changing trains is massive. You will pay more but it's worth it. South-west London is nice, suburbs surrounding Wimbledon or on the district line (green one) are good but very expensive but don't go as far as Sutton which is a dodgy area. Parts of the north-west really nice, suburbs on the metropolitan tube line from Harrow on the Hill and further out are generally pretty good. Places like Pinner, Northwood etc really nice and good schools. Out towards Heathrow on the piccadilly line pretty dodgy but northern line (black) are generally good but expensive. East End was always dodgy but has gentrified a fair bit apparently since the Olympics but i haven't been that way for years. The entire city is multicultural so don't worry about that. Your budget is massive as prices are off the charts in nice suburbs. DYOR and plenty of it.

 

Thaf doesnt tell me anything. Docklands is not the same as west end.

 

Wimbledon, Kew, Richmond, Chiswick, Ealing Balham, Clapham, Dulwich, nunhead, Islington, Hampstead, highgate, finchley, Camden, Fulham, Barnes, Hammersmith, primrose hill, chalk farm, notting hill....

My pick would be hampsted or west hapmsted.

All of London is pretty multicultural and all suburbs have rough areas and a mix of socio-economic groups.

Private schools are less popular in the UK and not funded by the gov (so they are expensive and often don't offer as many bells and whistles). There are some excellent government schools but they are tightly zoned. Nursery (preschool) is gov funded. There is a lot of data available on schools for comparisons.

I don't think London is particularly family friendly because PT is a challenge with little ones and drugs and gangs are rife. Compared to Sydney, there's a lot of knife crime, gang activity and muggings.

 

I think that @Esel has probably covered the obvious list.

I like it down in Southwest London, and lived in Richmond, Teddington, and East Sheen. I had friends living in Southfields (just outside of Wimbledon), and that's a good area too.

Richmond and Wimbledon have large parks, which gives you a bit of a break from all the concrete and pollution in London.

Shepherds Bush has gentrified in recent years, particularly with the arrival of Westfields.

My sister was in Kensal Green, and that looked decent.

One thing to bear in mind is that there are stopping and express services running through London. It used to be quicker to get from Richmond to Waterloo than from East Sheen (which is one or two stops closer in), because the latter meant you had to use the slow train.

Lastly, also look at places on railway lines just inside or outside the M25. It might be faster to get into town from St Albans than it would be from somewhere on the Tube in Zone 3. My older brother reckoned he could get from Brighton to central London quicker than his friend in Fulham could, but I suspect that he was exaggerating.

(Brighton's pretty cool, but outside of your 45 minute window.)

 

As others have alluded too, really can’t pre-empt until you get there. The concepts are different to Australia, whilst principles of transport, neighbourhoods, and schools are the same the world over.

1) Transportation. This is probably the number one key issue, unlike Australia where commuting time can cover large distances, commuting time can be relative short distances but can still take a long time. Use of public transport is very common, so need to factor in walking time from home to public transportation, public transport journey time, the time to walk to work for example. So identifying your work location is most important and from there can identify areas.

2) Property rent. Be prepared to be shell-shocked for what you pay and what you get. In general, property sizes are smaller than Australia. Property with say 4 bedrooms is very expensive or further out. You will set out large but likely to regroup your thinking and accommodation space (really depends how much you want to spend). Some good sites to check properties for rent are www.zoopla.co.uk and www.rightmove.co.uk. Note that council tax is generally borne by the occupant of a property and hence the tenant usually pays this amount which can be over a thousand pounds or more per year and don’t forget the TV license. Note that tenancy agreements are not as standardised as they are in Australia and really need to check who pays what. On the positive side, it is common for landlords to provide white goods and some furniture - need to check what’s on offer.

3) Schools. As discussed above.

4) Amenity, vibe, cafes, facilities. Really need to walk the streets and check out an area.

Having said that, the areas mentioned above are OK. Happy hunting. Please post an update of what you find when you get there.

 

I looked to invest in London last year but the financing proved to be too difficult. LVR I was getting was under 50% and the yields in prime central London are very low.

I really like Bayswater and Paddington (W2). It is Significantly cheaper than other areas that are adjacent to Hyde park (Kensington, Chelsea, Knightsbridge, Marlyebone) and with cross rail going in as others have mentioned, it will cut down commute times to Canary Wharf significantly.

The Heathrow express already gets u to Paddington in 15 minutes. The Qataris are revamping huge stretches of Queensway and the area will gentrify signfifiantly. Lots of lovely garden squares and Public spaces for families.

 

Paddington is a very handy spot because it's on the tube map but also has overground services to places like Reading. Lots of jobs particularly in the I.T. sector in Reading. If you land a job that requires an overland train, it would be a nuisance having to catch the underground and then the overland train.

 

How long are you planning to stay there? Do you want to replicate your experience here, or try to experience something different in London?

We lived there pre-kids (actually flew home when my wife was 28 weeks pregnant), I was working and my wife was studying her Masters. We lived in the "dodgy" end of Notting Hill (almost underneath the A40 motorway), and loved it. With kids, you might like to go slightly further out to get a larger place. Kensal rise was just over the way, and we often went to Bayswater, Paddington, Marlyebone, which would also be suitable areas.

If you want to get out of town a bit, there certainly are options that can access London by overland, but I'd be looking to minimise transit time, so you can spend more time living

We are actually heading back over for a few weeks at Christmas - be interesting to see the old neighbourhood 10 years later!

Cheers,
Inertia

 

I should add, I was working for a Telco in North Acton when I was there - which is a #%*&hole industrial estate with pretty much nothing of interest near by. I even worked in a windowless warehouse (also a data centre). Meanwhile my wife was studying at the Barbican, and her bicycle commute was like a trip around the Monopoly board...

 

Another option is new build . I saw a lot of developers covering the stamp duty costs which are huge in the UK if it’s your 2nd home worldwide. Helpful when you have a small deposit in AUD further eroded by currency fluctuations.

I feel central london is a a very stable and sticky market. Hard to get a bargain. But there was a lot of overbuilding targeting foreign investors and developers needing to move stock In a post brexit lull may present a buying opportunity

Ordinarily the growth Is better in period homes but with the general decline 10-15% in the market + the Stamp duty savings a lot of new build was looking fair value. That was 12 months ago prob even cheaper now

 

I agree generally with this post. It is horses for courses as to where you want to live. We don't have kids so cannot talk about schools. Just to give you some of our own experiences (we have been in London for almost 7 years - and will be back in Australia in a few years).

1. Before we moved here, people said live there, don't live there - so it was very confusing. I searched online first and found some rental houses in Peckham (big spacious 4 bed house on 3 levels). Then hubby's work colleagues said no one would want to live in Peckham unless we would not value our lives But of course there are always good and bad areas everywhere in the same area. So, don't discount an area because people say it is bad - walk the streets, check out the location. We live in Canary Wharf and like it here as CW has become very "trendy" (clean, nice parks, river views) and hubby works in CW, he can walk to office if there is a transport disruption (the tubes are packed like sardines during peak hours). CW is in the east end - I can show you exactly where we live on the river on the EastEnders show map (no, we don't watch that show). So, no one wants to live in CW, everyone avoids east London. However, we love it here - it has everything we need.

2. Yes, rent and transport in London are very expensive (some companies give interest free loan for employees to buy seasonal train tickets). So living close to work saves transport money and time to commute - and it probably works out the same overall. We hired a (shark) relocation agency to help us to find a rental place at first because it is very difficult to rent as a foreigner without rental history and references. They charged a months rent (not a week, but a month rent) but what they did not tell us that there would be 20% vat on top of that - imagine a big shock when they sent us the invoice! They looked for rental places (mainly a 2 bed flat with 1 or 2 bedroom on the Jubilee line (with CW tube station). They spent one day showing us about 20 places in the west - where people said desirable to live, but all were horrible - below ground without any sunlight (think of winter in London), no parking space, streets were narrow. They said these places were for the café latte-set and people love living in the west end. No thanks! I told them no deal, as we wanted to live closer to work for hubby. And, we had to increase our budget significantly (from £500 a week to £750 a week - eek!) We settled for the first rental house near the river and after 18 months moved to a bigger house right on the river for slightly less rent - this time I did it myself and without using any agent. After 4 years we moved to a smaller flat in a nicer location having unbeatable fantastic river views for less rent - again I did this, after viewing more than 20 places.

3. If you own your home in Australia (like us) and have not rented in Australia, then arm yourself with letters of references from friends, employer and write up a brief bio - all these will help in getting a rental place. When you move again, make sure you get the references from your landlords in writing - this will put you well ahead of other applicants.

4. Very different to Australia, RE agents in London are not licensed (anyone can set up an agency) and they will charge (a rip off admin fee!) when you put in an application. Also rent in London is negotiable, not fixed like in Australia. If they ask £500, you can say £480 - depending on how much you want the place. And, deposit here is 6 weeks rent, not 4 weeks like in Australia. I had to fight with the agent and landlords for our 1st rental place to get the deposit back - it is not automatic, dishonest agent / landlord hope you will forget about claiming the deposit. I had to threaten landlord to take him to court (which I would be awarded 3 x the deposit amount) - he knew I would win so he returned our money (almost £4K) on the last day before I went to court. So, be careful to keep records of your deposit.

5. Yes, tenants here pay council rates (not landlords like in Australia) - and this could add up to £3K a year (top band). For our 3 rental places we have had to pay the top band - even though the first 2 places are 3 / 4 beds, and this one 2 beds.

6. Yes, the TV license to fund the BBC (biased) services. If you don't pay, there is a huge fine.

7. Yes, most rental places come fully furnished (always have stove top, oven, fridge/freezer, washing machine/dryer, beds) but quality varies (get your own mattress, the one in rental places are disgusting). Ours have been partially furnished and we bought a few things from Ikea.

8. If you want to buy a car here be careful about getting insurance for it. Most insurance companies will not insure you unless you have lived in the UK for 3 years or more. We opted for a salary sacrified leased car from hubby's work as insurance was included. If you want a UK driver license than you have to surrender your Australian driver license.

9. You will find it will rather difficult to get a UK credit card and a UK bank account as a foreigner. What we did was to open a bank account with hsbc in Australia before we moved, then asked them to open a UK £ bank account (and UK credit card) for us before we arrived. After you move into your rental place, it is important to register yourself on the local council electoral roll - this will help you to apply for UK credit cards. Yes, commonwealth citizens are allowed to vote in all UK elections - and we did vote in the Brexit referendum

Having said all the above, we have enjoyed living in London - despite many hurdles in terms of renting and the complex tax issues involved. It is a great place for travel and we have been to places where it would be costly from Australia.

Best of luck with your move.

 

Thank you so much everyone for all the feedbacks, amazing really.

It definitely looks like a complex thing to put in motion practically with so many considerations in starting over. Taxation is one area that looks both complex and potentially costly, as it seems the Australian taxation regime looks more favorable than its UK counterpart.

We would be looking at trying it out for a bit first to see how we like it, perhaps for a couple years before deciding to keep going or coming back.
We do have family in Europe which would mean we would be able to see them much more regularly, easily and cheaply than from Sydney. Together with ease of travel to a range of interesting destinations and entertainment this is definitely one of the things that is attracting us to the place.

We are still pondering the positives and negatives tough, the cost of living in London especially accomodation is pretty crazy, even by Sydney standards!