Should I use a buyers agent?

Discussion in 'Commercial Property' started by Rayryed, 14th Jun, 2021.

Join Australia's most dynamic and respected property investment community
  1. Rayryed

    Rayryed Member

    Joined:
    7th Apr, 2021
    Posts:
    18
    Location:
    Sydney
    Hi everyone

    I have 5 residential atm and am looking to buy a commercial.

    Should I engage a buyers agent?

    Is a building inspection report as good as being physically there to inspect the premises?

    Can the solicitor take care of due diligence?
     
    ashish1137 likes this.
  2. Colin Rice

    Colin Rice Mortgage Broker Business Member

    Joined:
    9th Jul, 2015
    Posts:
    3,184
    Location:
    Perth
    I heard a stat the other day that only 1 in a 100 commercial properties is worth the effort, not sure how they determined this stat, however, the key is to find one and if a BA can help you do this it will be worth every cent, even better if it's without one.

    If the BI is experienced in commercial inspections then that will be the best option unless you are experienced in this area of expertise best to engage a professional.

    What do you mean by due diligence?
     
    The Falcon likes this.
  3. Rolf Latham

    Rolf Latham Inciteful (sic) Staff Member Business Plus Member

    Joined:
    14th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    10,654
    Location:
    Gold Coast (Australia Wide)
    Do mainly resi finance and lots of BA initiated purchases - the value is in the connection of being able to use the network the get pre listing opportunities

    Same applies to the few comm deals we do....

    So yes, a Comm BA can provide value

    Dont expect a 12 k fee though .............

    ta
    rolf
     
  4. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    15th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    11,679
    Location:
    Newcastle
    The worst real estate deal I was ever involved with was a commercial property recommended by a buyer's agent.
     
    spoon and Property Guts like this.
  5. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    27,255
    Location:
    Sydney or NSW or Australia
    Was that due to a poor BA recommendation or your lack of understanding of the investment or other side deals associated with the investment?
     
    Property Guts likes this.
  6. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    15th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    11,679
    Location:
    Newcastle
    All of the above.

    The BA was suggesting based purely on cashflow. I was naive and overeager. I ignored all the fundamentals. It was tenanted when I bought, but it was in a bad part of a country town. The tenants left, and I had tenants perhaps half the time I owned. I sold it at a loss.

    The BA is known in this forum. NB.
     
    craigc, ashish1137 and Scott No Mates like this.
  7. ashish1137

    ashish1137 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    12th Sep, 2015
    Posts:
    932
    Location:
    Sydney
    Commercial is a different beast.
    As @geoffw has highlighted, a bad purchase can nake or break your goals and hold you back by 3 to 10 years.

    Please use a tried and trusted agent or someone who knows what they are doing.

    Alternatively, educate yourself and buy. :)

    Regards
     
  8. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    27,255
    Location:
    Sydney or NSW or Australia
    A BA having a bad day? Insufficient research by the BA? Lack of comparable stock/deals?

    The number of times that I have spent time in small towns to get a feel for the place, using local knowledge for good/bad parts of town, walking the streets, sitting in 'coffee shops' listening to the conversations, chatting to a couple of agents and the locals (OK I was in a position to get to a few business operators in the places that I needed to visit).

    Even going around local CBDs, it's fairly easy to get a feel for what's happening (or not).
     
  9. Paul@PAS

    Paul@PAS Tax, Accounting + SMSF + All things Property Tax Business Plus Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    23,555
    Location:
    Sydney
    Commercial property is all about the tenant lease and their stability as well as their replacement prospects. In some locations replacement tenants may be easy and in others it can be a nightmare. Some properties can also be a revolving door of failure and low rents or a short term rent that stops. These properties may even have no substantial bond. Some then fall for the trap of a bad risk eg a first time small cafe start up that then also dies and leaves you with refit issues etc.

    Remember a BA doesnt sign a purchase contract. The buyer does and takes all risk. Caveat emptor ! If the best BA deal smells bad then walk on. Commercial agents are a different beast to resi agents.
     
    Simon Hampel and Scott No Mates like this.
  10. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    15th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    11,679
    Location:
    Newcastle
    I've had several people contact me about this matter.

    I've given the BA's initials, that should be enough to know what to avoid. This agent was purely into high cashflow properties.

    I've had no other dealings with BAs, so I can't make any recommendations. This was my first, and last, dabble with both BAs and commercial.
     
  11. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    27,255
    Location:
    Sydney or NSW or Australia
    No risk assessment? Risk IS the trade-off for high return.
     
    The Falcon and Beano like this.
  12. Property Guts

    Property Guts Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    16th Jun, 2018
    Posts:
    157
    Location:
    Australia
    Buyers agents might be ok for resi, but i can not support it for commercial. With apologies Geoff.

    From my observations, the most successful commercial property investors have an intimate understanding of business operations, of the needs and wants of business owners and the clients/customers they depend on. These type of investors seem better at assessing tenant risk, understand risk of losing income. Using a commercial a buyers agent, that's not delegating risk, that's abdicating risk.

    Want to get into commercial, but time-poor and cash-rich? Buy some Goodman shares on the ASX instead.

    Maybe SP will come to the defence of buyers agents?
     
    The Falcon and Scott No Mates like this.
  13. The Falcon

    The Falcon Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    3,426
    Location:
    AU
    I can’t help but notice a big upswing of interest in smaller commercial property purchases coming from resi investors, I think it’s driven by untenable resi yields and increased availability of information, in particular a certain podcast series that leads listeners to post here constantly about commercial buyers agents… Problem is, like Seagulls at the beach there aren’t enough chips (fair value + acceptable quality) to go around.

    Personally market seems very frothy everywhere but particularly at the sub $2m price and I think now is a time to think about learning and planning rather than embracing FOMO and rushing in.
     
    Scott No Mates and Big A like this.
  14. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    27,255
    Location:
    Sydney or NSW or Australia
    Someone has forgotten the important factors affecting this (& other) segments. These include - Risk: WFH has impacted demand, there's less competition when it comes to the >$5m market and again above $10m & $20m, most blue chip tenants don't locate in <$2m premises (need larger premises) ie you're dealing with smaller companies/mums & dads/sole traders.
     
    FXD and The Falcon like this.
  15. FXD

    FXD Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    30th Aug, 2018
    Posts:
    290
    Location:
    Melbourne, Victoria
    Hi Scott, are you talking about specific states and type of properties?

    Vic stamp duty has gone up by 1% for price tag of $2m and above. Not sure if that may have been
    one of the drivers pushing things up towards the $2m level, which otherwise wouldn't have been
    the case before the new duty hike.

    Anyway, recall some expert telling me few years back that the sweet spot with less competition
    but not big enough to be of interest to large institution buyers used to be around $2m-$3m range
    and from memory that's for Melb again. Wonder if that price range has now moved to the $5m just
    like your comment above? Cheers!
     
  16. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    27,255
    Location:
    Sydney or NSW or Australia
    It has moved $5-10m is still mum & dad territory, $10-30m is easily achievable for syndicates. Institutional grade is getting bigger again.

    Small properties present too much risk for institutional investors (property trusts, super funds etc).
     
  17. RRS

    RRS Member

    Joined:
    21st Feb, 2022
    Posts:
    5
    Location:
    Box hill
    Hi to all the experts.

    I have moved recently to Australia (just over an year) and i have now saved a bit for a downpayment for a entry level commercial investment property.

    Can you guys please suggest a commercial buyer agent who knows what he/she is doing and who you have used in the past?
     

Do you need help with investment strategies, don’t want to buy the wrong stocks, or you just need a regular income stream? We provide the research to ensure your investment selections achieve the goals. This is the value of advice.