Discussion in 'Politics' started by euro73, 24th May, 2019.
Yep - in many ways I feel sorry for her - but what a silly thing, to call a referendum on a misguided belief that you'll know the result - and the silly voters who put in their "protest" vote thinking it wouldn't count. Be careful what you wish for.
Personally, I think they should change the the law that a referendum needs 60% yes vote to change - and then damn well vote again.
It's also a reason I like the Australian rule that referendum's have a double majority ... Referendums in Australia - Wikipedia
Don't envy the one to pick up the poison chalice - and suspect old Boris won't be able to help himself
Buy that woman a beer!
She's got nothing but respect from me. After trying to move an immovable object for years...I genuinely hope that she gets to have a rest now.
Yes, it was a 52/48 majority with a 72.2 turnout: you can argue that those who didn't vote don't count, or perhaps they didn't vote because they had no strong feeling either way. Re your second point, a key thing was that in Scotland and Northern Ireland the majority voted remain but will be pulled out of the EC against their will.
Can't say I envied her job... oh well, may she scamper through many a wheat field.
There were numerous stories who voted to leave as a form of protest - thinking there would be an overwhelming "stay" vote and their protest vote wouldn't count ... well it did
And in the perverse way of things, the FTSE250 (mainly British companies unlike FTSE100) is up 123 points (0.65%) as I write this.
What a thankless and unenviable task she has had, tying to heard stray cats and save them from themselves and their own stubborn stupidity.
I'm surprised she didn't resign months ago out of sheer frustration. I get the impression she genuinely loves her country despite how obviously it doesn't love her.
Brexit is a disaster. People were lied to, didn't properly understand the ramifications.
I´m living in Spain on a British passport, although Australian by birth. This will have varying repercussions for thousands of Brits living in Europe, and is tragic for the youth growing up in Britain, who will largely be trapped there under a hard brexit. They need to have another vote, now that the reality of leaving the EU has been exposed.
p.s. she´s leaving in June, not May
May was a remainer during the original referendum. This isn’t really her mess. David Cameron, the PM who called the referendum, resigned as soon as he realised the mess he had created. Boris Johnson has always been a Brexiter and a buffoon.
So - will you be forced to leave? Is there an advantage to reverting to you Aussie side?
Esel - I agree - she loves her country and tried the damnedest she could but the cards were all stacked on the EU's side of the table.
I don’t like her politics, but I respect her for attempting to clean up the mess left to her by farage and Cameron, especially when all the men involved quit immediately and disappeared.
It was an impossible and entirely thankless task. No one in the country was happy with any of the options she put forth and then she had to front up to Europe and negotiate against the whole of the EU. Its not possible to unscramble this egg. I hope they end up with a second referendum.
Spain has said that the 300,000 British already registered as Spanish residents would be allowed to stay. Their continued rights to public healthcare, education, etc depends on how much the UK reciprocates (150000 Spanish in the UK). No advantage being Australian, they can't stay anywhere in the EU longer than 3 months without special visas. I have a backup though since I'm Irish as well (3 passports). The elderly pensioners here though could be in trouble since many of them rely on the very good public health system in Spain.
There are three fundamental problems with Brexit.
The country and government are incredibly split on the issue. Prior to the referendum campaign, opinion was roughly a third wanting to leave, a third wanting to stay, and the balance undecided; the vote was 52 to 48 to leave; and opinion polls suggest it's now 55 to 45 in favour of remain. As a result, it's hard to come up with an outcome that can carry majority support.
The Leave campaign never produced a concrete plan on how to achieve a Brexit. This was a deliberate choice as it made it hard for the Remain camp to argue against it. The complexity of extracting the UK from the EU has really become apparent since 2016, and the Brexiteer camp still downplays any costs as being "Project Fear".
Theresa May was dealt a bad hand, but she's also played it badly. She didn't reach out to build a cross-party consensus, favouring a hard Brexit from the get go. In fact, there have only been serious talks with the opposition in the last few weeks, and the process is already into extra time.
The most likely outcomes at the moment are a no deal exit, where the UK trades with the EU on WTO terms; a managed exit based around the deal that May negotiated; or revoking Article 50 and remaining in the EU.
Elections to the EU happened last week, and results are expected tomorrow or Monday. Polls suggest that Nigel Farage's Brexit Party is likely to win the most seats with around 35% of the vote, largely at the expense of May's Conservatives. The party is likely to select a hardcore Leaver as the next PM, particularly as the membership gets the final say on the leader, and they're older and somewhat more reactionary than the UK population in general.
The opposition Labour party is mostly in favour of remaining, but their leader Jeremy Corbyn is an old school socialist who's been resisting the call to support a second referendum. I think that he's responsible for a lot of the mess we're in because he's not held the government to account.
(A second vote is also considered undemocratic by Leavers, who're selling themselves as defenders of democracy. Yeah, it's all getting a bit topsy-turvy.)
Lastly, this YouTube video is fun viewing as it shows a somewhat clueless No Deal Brexiteer having his arguments demolished.
So perhaps a better thread title would have been
Last week of May is first week of June
Corbyn is calling for a general election, but I reckon whoever is in power will get smashed - there is no good result here. They either force the exit and cop the fallout, or Corbyn gets in and maybe holds another referendum, and will forever more cop it for going against the original referendum.
There is no good ending to this for the UK. If you read up on the conditions set by the EU for leaving, it's crippling - and a complete personal mass for hundreds of thousands, including those in the north of Ireland
It does seem a bit punitive. I would have thought the sensible approach would be to go like Switzerland, or perhaps Norway/Iceland/etc
*** doh - personal "mess"
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