Join Australia's most dynamic and respected property investment community

Is it hard to do both??

Discussion in 'General Property Chat' started by MTR, 19th Jan, 2016.

Tags:
  1. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    19th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    7,468
    Location:
    Perth, Melbourne, USA
    Over the years I have seen successful property investors/developers etc move on to operating property related businesses, ie BA, mentoring etc etc.

    I expect it would be very difficult to manage both efficiently?

    Personally I would rather focus on investing/developing to generate further income as I do not want the responsibility. or be accountable to anyone ....... less stress.

    I have met a number of successful investors/business operators who do both very well and on the flip side I have also seen some who fail miserably because they can not manage the stress or do not have the people skills because they have never had to be accountable to anyone other than themselves.

    What do you think?

    MTR:)
     
  2. Xenia

    Xenia Adelaide Property Manager Business Member

    Joined:
    21st Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    2,347
    Location:
    4/136 The Parade Norwood, South Australia
    Businesses take years to get established most fail in first 5 years.
    Yes it is difficult to do both if both are just starting.
     
    alexm, MTR, barnes and 1 other person like this.
  3. Leo2413

    Leo2413 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    5,820
    Location:
    Sydney
    I think if it's a passion you have to become a BA or do mentoring etc, then I would say go for it. Having the property investor background (have to be successful though imo) will obviously be a massive help and complement your business endeavor. But if its not something your passionate about and not able to add value to the client then I wouldn't bother.
     
    MTR, Xenia and D.T. like this.
  4. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Finance broker and strategist Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    2,104
    Location:
    Melbourne, Nationwide
    I suspect most of the investors/developer also in property related businesses go into them because they can generate significantly better short term cash flow than most investments. A property development project might make 6 or 7 figures by the time it's wrapped up, but it doesn't make much before then. Running some seminars can make a big difference for day to day cash flow.
     
    MTR and Xenia like this.
  5. barnes

    barnes Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    1st Jul, 2015
    Posts:
    674
    Location:
    Adelaide
    I use my property investing skills in other non related investments. And it really helps. After all everything you invest in is 50/50, it either goes your way or it doesn't.
    Mentoring is great if you have the time, but it always should be free. Than nobody can say that you have started mentoring because you cannot make money investing. :)
     
    Cactus and MTR like this.
  6. Jennifer Duke

    Jennifer Duke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    23rd Oct, 2015
    Posts:
    289
    Location:
    NSW » Sydney
    I guess a lot of people need an income to support their portfolio, particularly to keep blue chip homes.

    I see it in the same way as I do writing. Authors' main game may be writing a novel, but in the meantime they might work as a copyeditor full time/start a writing company - the passion for words goes both ways.

    Downfall is probably where investing in a personal portfolio is a set of entirely different skills to managing others' money, expectations etc and providing a service. I believe some genuinely want to give back. And some people just have excellent negotiating/auction bidding skills - it's more lucrative to put them to use for a lot of people regularly than to only benefit from them when they are ready to buy another investment...
     
  7. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Finance broker and strategist Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    2,104
    Location:
    Melbourne, Nationwide
    My understanding that writing on a topic where you've got good domain related knowledge (ie non-fiction) is generally more an exercise for marketing and exposure, rather than for it to become a full time source of income. Certainly it's something that requires commitment and passion, but from a business perspective the true value is one of generating awareness of the authors business.

    BTW, great article today @Jennifer Duke
    Why you didn't get that rental
     
    Perthguy and Jennifer Duke like this.
  8. Leo2413

    Leo2413 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    5,820
    Location:
    Sydney
    @Jennifer Duke I agree with Peter, Great article you wrote. Very informative and really on the money. Great stuff.
     
    Perthguy and Jennifer Duke like this.
  9. Cactus

    Cactus Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jan, 2016
    Posts:
    994
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Isn't the saying, those who can't teach???

    In all seriousness I always wonder the same thing, if someone is actually a successful developer/investor and assume that its either for walking the street money or genuine enjoyment/altruism.
     
  10. Leo2413

    Leo2413 Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    5,820
    Location:
    Sydney
    If we are talking about teaching/mentoring, then I know from talking to a few mentors that they do it for a few reasons. (at least the ones I know)

    1. They genuinely enjoy teaching others and watching them succeed.
    2. Many successful investors and developers are really passionate about their craft and feel they have some great skills and knowledge to pass on to the newbie and sometimes not so newbie, which can save them a lot of time and further motivate them to take action as they feel more supported.
    3. Its another great business avenue for investors/entrepreneurs/developers to establish this venture. Helping others doing what you love and getting paid for it.

    I have paid mentors in the past and also mentor. Personally, I feel the value a successful and experienced mentor can add to some people is tremendous. This forum is really one big informal mentor.
     
  11. Travelbug

    Travelbug Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    312
    Location:
    Sydney
    Have you ever watched Shark Tank? They won't tske on someone who has another business as well as the one they are presenting to them.
     
    Bran likes this.
  12. robboat

    robboat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    20th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    56
    Location:
    Sydney
    +1
    Friend in real estate asked if I could take over his property management role a while ago as I self manage and he thinks I have some good organisation skills....
    Decided to give it a miss because I cannot handle fools for a prolonged period and be nice about it.....my wife says I can be direct at times - I prefer "decisive".......:)

    Happy to stick to the main game and look after my business of generating passive income.
    Work steady most times, take the good with the bad, but I enjoy it.......

    There are some "Type A" stress junkies who can do both....always busy and time poor....chained to the phone!
    I wonder how effective they really are......
     
    Perthguy and MTR like this.
  13. Jennifer Duke

    Jennifer Duke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    23rd Oct, 2015
    Posts:
    289
    Location:
    NSW » Sydney
    Thank you!
     
  14. Redwood

    Redwood Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    22nd Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    342
    Location:
    Melbourne
    Hey MTR -

    Good post - many 'mentors' mentor and also push their own agenda. There are a heap of examples that come to mind, you gather a following and bang sell them your product.....you know like a cult:)

    Cheers Ivan
     
    Perthguy, MTR and hobo like this.
  15. RumpledElf

    RumpledElf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    21st Jan, 2016
    Posts:
    137
    Location:
    Sydney
    I'm the reverse here, I've dropped to part time work for a while as I'm making enough from rent to do so. Can't keep it up longterm though.

    I was actually thinking of reskilling as a financial counsellor. Not entirely related though, the main employers are charities, getting people on low incomes out of a financial hole. Although am also investigating a business venture with a friend, he's easily distracted though and he's sales so I actually do need him.
     
  16. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    19th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    7,468
    Location:
    Perth, Melbourne, USA
    Cash flow Capital comes to mind, massively successful. Marketing, marketing, marketing.... the usual hold seminars all around the country and people flock. They buying properties everywhere in Australia and US.

    MTR:)
     
  17. Westminster

    Westminster Tigress at Tiger Developments Business Member

    Joined:
    13th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    2,959
    Location:
    Perth
    I think it depends on the level that you want to take it to.
    I limit the number of people I take on as clients because I don't want to do it as a job. It's not a career but it is emotionally and financially rewarding. It does help with income but not as much as a development. I might make $50k this FY from it.

    For me, I get most of the enjoyment out of it by helping people. We all give a lot of free advice here on the forum but when people want to have a more indepth help and learning, you can't do it all for free.

    I agree that helping people and being 'responsible' for their outcomes is hard.
    I have to be very upfront with clients about the risks involved. Even then I won't take on projects which are high risk for them. I don't want to be fighting a Council for 12mths on their behalf and they end up hating me for a project that can't get off the ground. I can/will only do projects which are solidly feasible with low risk.

    WAAAAAAY above me are the people that do seminars and have cults of worshippers and make $$$ from it. I always question why they need to do these seminars if they are that good as property.
     
    Cactus and Perthguy like this.
  18. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    19th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    7,468
    Location:
    Perth, Melbourne, USA
    I think because most of these gurus are actually making massive amounts of money from their business ie seminars/workshops, mentoring program, project management, feasibilities. They also have the opportunity to take on development stock and just flip it over to clients with little work other than marketing.

    I really think some of these larger business' have lost their way, and seems people are very easily sucked in.

    MTR:)
     
  19. Redwood

    Redwood Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    22nd Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    342
    Location:
    Melbourne
    MTR - you know re pushing your product, the timing of my last post coincided with the other thread - all these gurus including him, use their 'expertise' to mentor and then push a fund or development at the end. At the end of the day, naive investors fall for the the trap of "FREE" seminars to learn how to save tax and invest with $20 a week, thats crap, they get you there project a story that your property will grow by 10% a year which is BS and then show you a property.....do their disclose their commission? s%^t no, no one works for free.

    You can go on naming them - I see them all and try to clean up the mess, most investors don't do a google search on the property / area they are buying in....just sign a contract.

    Its disgusting. A true mentor should be fee for service, if he/she is having a FREE seminar, ask them how they put food on the table...."Commissions" and they are big - I am upfront with everyone I deal with. I tell them what my cost is and how my firm makes money. I share my experience cause i'm passionate, and upfront. ITs amazing even in the mortgage broking world how many do not disclose their commissions....

    Mentors become pushers....


    Cheers Ivan
     
  20. Westminster

    Westminster Tigress at Tiger Developments Business Member

    Joined:
    13th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    2,959
    Location:
    Perth
    I agree they are raking it in this way and gone past helping people and just $$$$. At the mature ages of many of them either they are spending faster than they earn it or the lure of the money is too great. I wonder what happened to their original goals to most likely reach financial independance and enjoy life.