Dual occ

I'm pretty sure that's a bull... a little bit more difficult to milk than a cow.

 

Loving the cows!

 

Around here it makes no difference whether the properties are joined together or 2m apart. Pre construction they would both be valued as a dual occupancy property and after completion can both be torrens titled.

 

Based on this I have to question your valuations then.

I've have House and Granny Flats in Sydney (not regional) and I have had them valued quite a few times to extract equity from 2010 to now.

Some are 3 bedder house + 2 bedder granny flat, another is 4 bedder + 2 bedder granny flat. All have their own street frontages. I've also helped family and friends with similar setups and they've had theirs valued post build.

All of them have been walk through valuations with different banks / different brokers. All valuations note them down as "detached granny flats", but they all compared to 4/5/6 bedroom homes.

For the most part, they fall in the middle. I have had 5 bedroom homes valued more than a 3 bed house + 2 bed granny flat and in the same report I've had another comparable to a 5 bedroom home valued at less.

The valuers don't care if I got proper separate meters (from Sydney water), separate phone lines, separate electricity, separate gas. It's all the same to them

Sorry Euro, but your claim of $50k higher in valuation does concern me a bit. If a client of yours was to source lending through a different broker and did a walk through val, would they get the same numbers as you?

 

I don't do the valuations - valuers do them. Whether I order them or Joe Blow orders them, that process occurs via either Valex or VMS. Valex or VMS assign/allocate the job. I don't. Even if I had those sorts of powers with either Valex or VMS, do you seriously believe I can then also influence the valuer to whom the job is allocated, and on every property I ever sold?

There's a wider point you are missing as well. When you REvalue your properties to extract equity, they are already established dwellings. I was referring specifically to the FIRST time they are valued, based on a new build - using a fixed price HIA build contract, drawings, schedule of finishes, and land contract.

To answer your question - yes I expect anyone else ordering valuations through Valex or VMS would get exactly the same results as me, unless you believe HTW, Propell, Taylor Byrne, CBRE, MVS, Opteon and every other valuer is doing me some kind of favour every time they value a property I sold.... just because Im such a nice guy?

This isnt my first rodeo. Ive been in this game a loooooong time and have seen maaaaaany valuations in that time. Not dozens. Not even hundreds. Thousands and thousands...
One of these days you may just have to accept that the reason I dont ever have val issues is because I know what Im doing and I kinda sorta do a great job putting these deals together....

 

@euro73 In your opinion, how do you think those in the Orange/Bathurst will stack up when they do another valuation 1 year after completion? Same as today or higher?

 

Just had a 3 bedder + granny flat valued at completion at 550K, on 700M2. The developer built that one for himself . We are selling larger 4 bedders + granny flat on 800-900M2 , so I'd expect 580-610K.

When you consider that new 4 bedroom homes in the area are getting low 500's - mid 500's , the 530K we are asking for what is effectively 5 bedrooms speaks for itself

8 Coates Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125451798 - realestate.com.au

13 Cheviot Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125450566 - realestate.com.au

46 Cheviot Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125437678 - realestate.com.au

68 Wentworth Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125461654 - realestate.com.au

5 Redding Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125425162 - realestate.com.au

10 Dillon Drive Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125334002 - realestate.com.au


And there is a vanilla 5 bedder , without the ability to offer 2 rental incomes , asking 599K.

6A Negundo Place Kelso NSW 2795 - House for Sale #125126262 - realestate.com.au


I'm aware of another company offering dual occ under one roof ( 4 + 1) where the total house size for all 5 bedrooms is a touch smaller than just my 4 bedder house, and they are getting valuer support at 570K.

So I guess, do the math

 

That is a load of Bull.......no tarty cow there....

 

it's a cash bull then

 

For valuations sake it appears to be wise to ensure that if you are building a 4+1 or 3+2, make sure that there are similar 'traditional' dwellings with the same 5 bedrooms valued higher than your build cost. Easier said than done given a new build on the same size land, particularly with the higher cost per square metre for dual occs, should be more than am existing dwelling all other things being equal. A good amount of the paper profit post valuation must rely on getting a good deal on the existing property or land, or building better value than average. This is in reference to under one roof dual occs, granny flats could be different...

 

@euro73 are you having the valuation come back on the right figure every time 1st time, or have you had to valuation shop with different lenders?

 

Its been first time, every time @Brady , for the first 8 of these we have sold in the first tranche. 6 in Bathurst ( Raglan and Kelso) and 2 in Orange

Opteon. HTW. Saunders Staniforth . Multiple different lenders used as well. All at the contracted price of 530K. All with cat 2 and 3 risk ratings, which as a banker you would know is very good, especially for brand new stock. (160K land. 370K build) I have some of the vals available and have attached them below FYI - these are ordered through NAB, ANZ and STG.

To put it in some further perspective, the builder /developer had begun his own 3 bedder + granny flat in Orange, well before we started offering this updated larger 4 bedroom + granny flat version to clients , and his completed one has just been valued at 540K. That's smaller, and 1 bedroom less, and has valued 10K above the price of the 4 bedder + granny flat.

There's also a local builder doing 4+1 under one roof in Orange, where his total M2 for all 5 bedrooms is a touch smaller than just our 4 bedder, and he has been getting val support at 570K. So his product is smaller, isn't detached so doesnt have the additional 60M2 granny flat , and is 40K dearer.

Older, vanilla 5 bedders with single rental income potential in Orange and Bathurst are asking mid - high 500's. - mid 600's... so from every reasonable view, it appears we are @ 7-10% under market value with this product... perhaps even more than 10% .... and have the added benefit of offering a detached secondary dwelling rather than being under one roof.

 

Is there any minimum land size requirement for a dual occupancy (under one roof)?

It seems to me that if you use it as a PPOR then you can do it on smaller lots in Perth. However, if it’s an IP where you are renting it out to separate families then you need minimum 450sqm of land.

 

I believe 450m2 or greater is allowed to have a secondary dwelling via Complying Development according to the SEPP as long as you meet certain criteria.

You could achieve a secondary dwelling via DA if you meet all the criteria necessary perhaps, depends on alot of factors including whether the council allows it.

Best to consult a town planner with your individual needs and see whether it is viable in your LCA.

Regards

 

3 and a half years later, dozens and dozens of Dual Occ's later...... Bathurst. Orange. Now Goulburn. Still tracking at 100% of valuations on the button. First time. Every time. Any lender. Any valuer.