Domestic violence leave

Oh and as for what is the next type of leave (@Bayview you suggested "car trouble stress" leave), well my prediction is the next type of leave will be "pet leave", kind of like personal leave, but used when one of your pets is ill, injured or dying.

 

Chill. Go back and read my first post. I agree with some of your sentiments.......in that Govt choosing to impose another type of leave just passes on responsibility to employers......with Govts and law enforcement taking little to none of the responsibility.

When I said balance above in the post you quoted, it was within that same context.

And no - employees are paid to do their job. That is.

Hard work, loyalty and commitment only comes from workers when they feel appreciated and respected by their employers.

As for the rest of your comments - I currently live and work in the US.......land of $7.25 minimum wage.

Personally, I favour a middle of the road approach that benefits everyone, rather than a few....but that's a discussion worthy of a separate thread.

Cheers.

 

I pity you, because that hasn't been my experience. The majority of people just want to live decent lives......and yes, there are the exceptions who will always try to find that angle to scam their way throughout their lives.

But to suggest that the majority would fake domestic violence as an excuse get time off work is absurd.

 

Don't pity me, I'm awesome.
It's the people around me who are a bit ****.

 

I have no doubt your awesome. If you say so, I believe you. I don't know you.....why would I think anything else.

But are you really suggesting that you distrust the MAJORITY of people you know and have encountered in your life. If that is really the case, I do pity you. I hope and wish better for you.

 

Oh come on, you're just saying that.

Didn't say that darl.
But any excuse you can think of, someone will have tried to use it before.

 

Why wouldn't I think your awesome until I have personal experience of you.....until then, I take you at your word for it. You can tell me anything. I may not believe it.....but I won't dismiss it out of hand. I stay neutral.

As for calling me "darl".......I have been accused of being condescending when I use that term within the same context you just used.

I smiled when I read your response.......cause I guess in those circumstances, I was being condescending. Am I offended.....nope.

Because, I asked you is that your experience of the majority of people you know.

 

So; you're saying just do the minimum as per job description (or less), and expect to have full respect from your Employer, and only then will you go harder and take a few for the team?

Just work with no real loyalty or commitment, minimum effort, and yet expect respect?

Sorry, but that is not my experience as an Employer and as an Employee.

Most Employers will look at those Employees who continue to do "the bare minimum" as per their job description with a basic level of respect, but never higher than that..."courteous detachment" I would call the Boss's attitude towards that type of Employee.

But, an Employer will look at an Employee who displays hard work, commitment, a willingness to grow a better company/workplace, to think of ways to increase the profitability of the company, to show initiative - to do the extra yards - with a different level of respect, and these folks are usually the ones who get the promotions, the good breaks etc...many often end up becoming a partner in the Business.

So; should an Employee display hard work, loyalty and commitment to the Company and the Employer, or should they merely do their basic job description, and still expect equal levels of respect?

I think I know what type of Employee I would choose to be and take a lot of the guess work out of it...do less and it's a given you will receive only the basic level of respect (or deteriorate to bugger-all); do more and you definitely will receive the higher level.

 

I have been an employer. And have worked as a contractor.....and in senior management...... and am currently employee.

And yes - you can only expect and assess an employee to work as per their duty statement. Anything else is a bonus........that comes from mutual respect and the expectation of mutual benefit. Alternatively, you as an employer pays more and get what you pay for.

If an employee knows they are a clog in the productivity machine, why would they believe that their employer would care about their personal life.

If an employee doesn't believe that their efforts are going to be rewarded with at the very least, appreciation, why bother going above and beyond.

 

Contrary to popular belief many employers do care about the wellbeing of their employees and will make allowances as long as they believe they are not being taken for a ride, however allowing specific leave days for domestic violence leave is just grandstanding on a very serious issue.

If people need to take leave for DV then it should be reported to the authorities not their boss.

Governments at all levels have spent a lot of money bringing DV out of the dark and removing the shame associated with it, there are many grassroots organisations that have taken up the call and organise community activities.

It's important that when a report is made it is not treated lightly. Relevant investigations should be undertaken, treatments made available to reduce the risk of re-offending (with this or future partners) and in cases where it is considered appropriate the offender removed from the community.

For the victim there needs to be suitable emergency contacts, accommodation and support in place to meet their immediate needs, as well as counselling and legal services to help them move forward.

If someone has to take 5 days DV leave (either all at once or 5 separate incidents) then there is a serious problem and chances are that others will need to take bereavement leave to pay their respects.

Regards

Andrew

 

I agree with absolutely everything you've said except the part about "get what you pay for". Whilst solid remuneration is important I think employees value the way they are treated every day as most important.

 

Well, if every employee took your attitude that they might not get rewarded for their (extra) effort; "so stuff it; I won't do it...."

You don't know that your efforts won't be rewarded when you first start at a company, so the best advice is to assume they will be, and put in a 110% effort in my opinion..

If it turns out you don't get the reward for extra effort; you can then move to another workplace.

My experience is that most Employers like to reward those who put in and do that bit extra.

Put it this way; my mindset is an employer mindset - even as an Employee - and has always been one of; "How can I help my Boss do better/get richer/make myself more valuable?

It has always worked for me; but then; I've never been a sponger who expects more than I put in, and my experience is that the better value you add to your Boss' business; they better they look after you.

 

Once u get to a certain level of pay youre absolutely right imo, if you're talking low pay then sometimes commercial realities mean pay packet is valued higher.

Good example is chevron, they often pay less than their competitors but have good staff retention because a lot of people feel theyre good and fair employers

 

For sure. Especially government employers, who generally lead the way with this sort of thing.
But by the same token, government jobs would also be the most likely to be taken advantage of.

 

Agree, Sanj.

But; folks on lower pay can get on their front foot and create more;

For example; one of my ex-employees (a Trainee Golf Pro at one of the Golf ProShops I ran) was the best employee I've ever come across anywhere I've worked/run a business.

Trainee wages back then were not too hot, so he used to offer to take on extra tasks/roles for extra pay.

He was paid more as a result, and because of his commitment he also got to receive other non-cash rewards along the way; me paying his expenses to go to a tournament etc.

Conversely; my mechanic (who is a top bloke, good worker)..gets paid above award due to his experience and so on (plus I'm just a bloody fantastic bloke and like to pay staff more for no damn good reason ); in 3 years with me, has never offered to take on any other extra roles such as learning the computer to do invoicing, learning about tyre sizes, prices and so forth, never offered to learn the cash register...if he knew these things he could run the entire shop himself, and be paid as a Manager and earn more.

BUT; instead - lives like a pauper and spends absolutely no money on anything; made the comment once about not being able to afford to go away on hols..

 

Agreed. I said the same. Employees will go above and beyond when there is mutual respect and the expectation of mutual benefit.

Bayview - you are full of contradictions. Your trainee example feed into my argument. Your trainee took on more roles/tasks after knowing that you would reward him/her to do so. To get that reward, he/she did their job well.

Look at it from the other side of the coin.

Imagine if you were employing someone who is over qualified for the position. Do you expect them to work as per their experience or as per your job specifications.

In the case of your mechanic, you decided to pay more.......which again was in line with my argument.

I have worked in these situations and when your skills are being used and there are no rewards in sight, it just leads to resentment.....because you know that you are being exploited.

 

You are comparing simply doing over and above the basic work description as a loyal, committed Employee who is that way due to being looked after by their Boss, versus an Employee who is more enterprising by offering to do more for more pay irrespective..

The two are not the same, but both Employee types are what I believe all Employees should strive to be...of course; I live in dreamland.

The scenario was this; I (as many Employers do) merely provided the workplace environment for my employees to (hopefully) enjoy coming to work and working...give them a bit more than they expect, and hopefully get some loyalty and committeemen in return - and fortunately; I did.

Mind you; Golf is an industry which fosters, encourages and usually involves young blokes (and now many girls) of good character, values and work ethic (unlike much of the automotive industry) so it is a bit easiler to get good value out of your wage dollars that you pay out each week.

My Golf Trainee took on board the mindset all by himself to offer extra services and so forth to increase his income. He did not know that I would offer reward for those services until he asked, and he did not offer them for free.

The fact that he offered though was music to my ears; it indicated that I had an Employee who was interested i the business; not just an Employee who turns up, does an adequate job; but not much more involvement than that.

Any of the other Trainees could have done the same (I had 3 Trainees at this time), but the other two chose not to. That's fine; I had no problem with that, but they could have done a fair bit better for themselves by becoming more involved in the business's interests.

Not to say they did not do their job well; the other two did a good job, and we all got on famously.

The example of my mechanic being in the second category was mentioned as a contradiction because I find it strange that a guy like him who needs/wants more money - has an opportunity to get it right in front of him, yet chooses not to.

We will never agree on which one comes first - the Boss going over and above, or the Employee going over and above.

In my dreamworld they both will.

I just know this; the Employee who does the least and expects the most; is usually in for a poor future; irrespective of their Bosses.