Domestic violence leave

As I said above, I think there are valid reasons for moving away from sick leave to personal leave. We're talking about days ......not weeks....of paid time off.

An employer is entitled to accept or deny a request for time off work.......and nothing more. They can reject or accept a request for paid time off. They are not entitled to any more information about our private lives than we are willingly and trustingly wanting to provide it to them.

But to treat a victim of abuse with suspicion .......just re-abuses the victim .....just a time when they don't need another layer of paperwork and doubt.

 

As an employer and a business leader I stand for empowering women. I can read people well and can pick up where someone is being thwarted by an insecure partner before they do.

A young lady in my office was constantly told that she was lucky to be with her boyfriend by him and his entire family. She was an attractive 19 year old woman and I actually felt that she was inferior to him - this is abuse!!!

I asked her why? She came up with all sorts of reasons he is the smart one, he's good looking, there are lots of girls who like him ... This lady's self esteem was squashed beyond recognition.

I kept asking her questions to challenge those beliefs - which were simply not true. Overtime she changed her views and saw him as an insecure little boy and she left.

Women that are in abusive relationships first of all see themselves as inferior and secondly are scared to leave because they believe that he is the protector and they will be worse off somewhere else.

They do not yet know their own power and it's their own power that an abuser is most scared of.

The truth is that Only very very small people abuse and bully other people they do this to feel better about themselves and to hide their own insecurities.

It's great that there is a law about taking leave but the abuse starts way way way before there is a need to take a leave and the more we recognise it the better society is going to be.

Wanting to control the behaviour of other people, what they wear, what they eat, Who they talk to and what they say is a serious psychological control issue that needs to be identified and stopped before it actually turns into emotional or physical abuse.

 

Xenia
well said.
We're you a psychologist in your last life

 

Personally I absolutely agree with the PM on DV leave.

Yes, employees receive personal leave (10 days per year unless your employer is more generous), plus 20 days annual leave. DV leave is a type of emergency leave - and may I add that it is not restricted to only women. There are plenty of men out there in domestic violence situations, we just don't hear about it as frequently.

To those who say that an employer has no right to know about your personal life - well sorry but I don't fully agree. If an employee is frequently absent then as an employer I want to know because I care about their wellbeing. I don't want my employees to suffer in silence, if an employee feels they cannot tell the employer about their illness or injury then it says a lot about the lack of trust and the corporate culture in that workplace and frankly that is a larger issue.

For DV, this is not a problem that can be fixed by using a couple of personal leave days and some annual leave. DV is also not restricted to those with low socio economic backgrounds.

If one of my employees was dealing with DV, I would be very receptive to giving them time off to help them deal with their issues. Large companies may also offer other support such as crisis counseling and EAP programs.

Not every business is totally insensitive, there are many who really care, trust and value their employees. I think the skeptics out there just haven't worked for one of them. I actually think the tragedy here is that the government has to mandate this leave type for it to exist and be available.

End of rant.

 

Belittling, argument twisting sarcasm like this for example, very common from women, in my experience.
I never said violence against women is not a problem, just that any abuse men received would be ignored.

 

Hard work and commitment is what employees are paid for....or is it ok for them to slack off and turn up now and then, on-time or not, arrive late and leave early, take too long for smoko and lunch, not look for ways to grow/help the business?

Without profits, businesses don't exist, and no-one has a job.

*Folks already get 11 sick paid workdays per year - now called "personal" leave,
*They get 4 weeks of paid annual leave per year - some industries get more, and a good number get leave loading on those annual leave days as well,
*They get paid for not being at work on a public holiday - 13 in Vic; that's 2 more weeks of paid leave per year,
*They get paid 3 months fully paid leave for having worked at the business for 10 years,
*The Employers pay your Superannuation for you, and it is increasing every year.
*You cannot sack folks on the spot for anything they have done which is destructive or detrimental to the business; even stealing - there has to be 3 written warnings....

And as I said earlier; there has to be extra staff to cover those days in a large number of businesses - plus the extra cost in the Worksafe Insurance premium for the increase in wages...no employees ever consider all this.

And you reckon that to not add on another week of paid leave is not balanced?

How much more paid leave would you like to see implemented to' "keep it balanced"?

This is what you and the Billy Bobs of the world don't get...and they will destroy productivity and jobs in the process of cheap vote grabbing.

Godhelp us if he becomes PM; unemployment will bit double-digits real quick.

I'd like for a change to see a Pollie get up and say; "Look kids; you've had enough chocolate; no more"...

 

Sounds like the self esteem issue was already there, and only exacerbated by the boyfriend's family.

Good to see she saw the light, grew strong and vamoozed.

 

DV leave is not chocolate. It is not a sweet little "extra" that you get for being good. Comparing DV leave to annual leave, long service leave, superannuation etc is comparing apples and oranges. The AL/LSL provisions are extremely generous in Australia and there are historical reasons for this, I'm fairly certain that any PM that wants to take away an Australian workers right to 4 weeks AL will be out of office pretty quickly. As for superannuation, that is called a cost of doing business. Every employer wears that cost, it is for the benefit of employees and the country as a whole so suck it up.

DV leave is more like compassionate leave, not an "entitlement" in the sense that if you don't use it you lose it (a common perception of personal leave) - but DV leave has a finite limit, in a different way to compassionate leave.

For the other employers out there that complain about having to pay an additional leave, which is designed to be used in a personal emergency crisis situation, take a hard look at yourselves - people are a valuable resource and are not machines. Some care and compassion will reward you ten times over the benefit that you give. If you are concerned about the people that may abuse the system then start managing them! Do not penalise all for the behaviour of some.

 

Let me guess; you've never been an employer.

 

Guess again

 

They/we/I already do.

Sadly, the employees don't like to "suck it up" when they are told "don't come Monday" after another round of retrenchments due to decreasing profits/losses..

What is the unemployment rate currently?

 

It's a figure of speech; an analogy.

Why do folks here always take things so literally?

Employees will always continue to ask and accept more benefits and goodies..it's human nature; hence the "kids and chocolate" analogy...and the BiIly Bob union hacks will always be there in the kids' ears saying; "go on; keep asking for more chocolate; or pay us and we'll do it for you"

It means; "Look, you are all on a pretty good deal already. Don't you think you've already got enough?"

Of course; employees will never agree with that.

That's fine; just don't whine when the pink slip turns up in the pay packet (another figure of speech).

 

Yes redundancies and job losses are also a part of the employment cycle and in my view should be avoided wherever possible but sometimes there is no other option. If in your business you have people coming in late, leaving early etc. without approval then this is certainly affecting your productivity (and likely engagement) and should be be addressed and managed ASAP. I am of the view that people are inherently good, treat them fairly and well and they will reward you. For those that take advantage then they are managed, if no improvement then they are exited.

As for the unemployment rate, the ABS says that the Australian seasonally adjusted unemployment rate for October is 5.9%. (Source: http://www.abs.gov.au/ausstats\[email protected]?Opendocument)

From memory, anything at 5% or less is considered "full employment" so that is a pretty good rate. Workforce participation is still only at 65% which is also reflective of the large number of people who are part timers or casuals.

Anyway... I digress. Back to our regular scheduled topic.

 

FFS.

Most employers value good staff, know they are an asset, a valuable resource, ra, ra, ra,....and any employer who isn't on that program never keeps staff.

We are talking about; how much is enough?

What will be next? another paid week off for..... car problem stress? and so on.

Folks "abusing the system" are merely those who take their sick days - when they are not sick....that is commonplace, almost encouraged and applauded as the Aussie way.

I'm not saying that DV is to be dismissed or diminished in any way. It is a disgrace.

I'm saying - as have others here - it is already in place via sick/personal leave...and we cannot afford more paid sick leave in our economy.

 

Sorry i made you feel small, silly and ridiculous. To be honest i didnt think you were being totally serious because i didnt believe that anyone in Australia, with all the media attention on DV, could be this uninformed and naive. But here you are.

Yes, the policy would apply to men and women equally. It would be illegal not to.

Would really love you to expand on your last sentence.

 

Heheh you're getting exasperated. We can agree to disagree. I don't see DV leave in the same way as personal or sick leave. It's not a leave type that can be misused, same as compassionate leave.

I think you're being pretty harsh and are just looking at this from one perspective i.e. as an entitlement; it's just another entitlement to add to the list that we already have. The tax payer is paying for this etc. It's not an entitlement in the same way, it's a form of emergency leave and specifically recognises a particular type of trauma.

The amount of employees that would use this leave type would be minimal at best. I would not be surprised if the govt requires employers to report on how many of these leave days are utilised, to try and get an understanding of the extent of the problem.

Anyway this is a fascinating topic and very interesting to read others views. I had never thought this issue would be so polarising!

 

Not at all...just added my FFS for interest and shoit-stir factor.

If I was exasperated; I'D BE WRITING IN CAPITALS!!!

FWIW; I don't view it as an entitlement; I view this new proposed new leave as: a cheap vote grab by a Pollie who is likely to lose his job soon due to sliding popularity on a grand scale, a waste of time, which will eventually morph into general personal leave and thus be misused by the usual suspects, and ultimately cost jobs.

I fail to see how you reckon the taxpayers will be paying for this new leave; the Employer pays the cost of the leave.

Can they then pass on the cost to the public? Very doubtful.

Everyone fails to connect the reality that despite record low interest rates and the recent $30k small business incentive; businesses are still very much down on investment and borrowings, and unemployment is up. (yes, yes; recent figures show an improvement apparently, but still not a flash environment).

If folks think that this new leave won't morph into just another 5 days of paid personal leave that the Employer will have to shoudler; they are naive.

Gleefully happy to be proved wrong.

 

Welcome to planet Earth.
I've heard all of the excuses.

 

No I don't think the taxpayer will pay for this leave. Everyone will pay for this leave as businesses increase their cost of goods and services to allow for this additional leave provision. How much effect this will actually have is variable but honestly I would expect the effect to be negligible.

It may only benefit a few, but when people use this leave it is an extreme crisis. A very small contribution from the people of Australia may save or improve hundreds of lives each year. To me, that is a worthy investment.

As for unemployment being up, well no, it's actually down. At 5.9% it may well be considered by many economists as full employment - for various reasons a developed country cannot achieve 0% unemployment. The participation rate shows a more complete picture when combined with the unemployment figures.

I do not see the current business environment as doom and gloom at all. In fact, I see Australia as a very prosperous place to do business and despite the high cost (of doing business) it is still a very stable business environment. With only a few minor exceptions it is also a politically stable and politically responsible country (overall).

I also do not think DV leave will "morph" into an extension of personal leave. If anything, it will combine with the current compassionate leave provisions.