Body corp getting nasty

This is the 2nd email ive got from body corp this week regarding one of my units. The firat email bc sent to me was - your tenants are making noise we going to fine you.

Any advice on what to do?

Hi.

I asked an independent person, whose word I trust, to confirm either paries statements. Below is the reply I recievced

'My wife and i both smoke outside now and can confirm the screaming, swearing
and yelling attacking each very loudly for long periods and often, they now 3 cars taking up spaces."

I understand from the above reply they have three (3) cars on site, one being unregistered. They are to remove at least two (2) from the complex otherwise I will have recourse to breach them under the Act. I would remind you that the maximun penalty is $2400 per breach plus legal costs against the Owner as well as the Tenant.

I understand that the Tenant has two (2) pets. I would remind you for future referrence that Occupiers require Body Corporate approval to house pets; this regardless whether the Owner agrees or not.

If you have any further questions please contact me at the phone numbers below or by email

On behalf of the Body Corporate





​

 

Its not clear who the email is talking about, or what is going on. Want to give us a bit more information?

 

Send it on to your managing agent/pm...afterall, they are managing on your behalf

 

I own 25% of the complex so have a few votes there.

I think it a bit stupid on bc behalf to immediately start threaten me with fines of $2400 per "offense" - but its all hearsay.

 

If you don't tackle it properly, hearsay will soon become a formal breach notification. Penalty and fines are the only way for body corporate to enforce the rules so yes, they will likely use it upfront.

Based on the email, I gather the below (correct me if I'm wrong):

1. Your tenant has been reported to cause disturbance and noise that cause grievance to other residents
2. Your tenant has parked their cars where it doesn't belong and cause other residents to be unable to use their space
3. Your tenant has pets and you have allowed them to without BC approval

^ They are all breaches of by-laws. I'd suggest to get your PM to talk to them and have it sorted.

 

There is a complaint / an issue, the executive committee has notified you as owner, deal with it.

 

1. Is the property located in Queensland?
2. Has the body corporate issued you with a contravention notice?
3. Did the body corporate validly resolve to issue you the contravention notice?
4. Did the contravention notice comply with section 182(4) of the Body Corporate and Community Management Act 1997 (Qld) (BCCMA)?
5. What power does the body corporate have to issue you with a fine? Failing to comply with a contravention notice is a breach of the BCCMA, however it is not the body corporate that can impose this penalty.
6. Did any contravention list the owner or the occupier? From what you have said, it appears the tenant is the one in breach of the by-laws.

 

1. Yes QLD
2. Yes. They issued straoght away witout try to resolve anything. This is what i dont think is right
3. No
4. Not sure
5. Im assuming it just a threat to get tennant kicked out
6. Listed both. Appartently im responsible for my tenant actions

 

If the issues are valid then just fix them. It really doesn't matter how you were notified unless you are intending to keep the extra cars, pets and noise. Work with the body corporate not against it.

 

Regardless of whether you think it is right or not , it's a valid way to run things .

Ignore it at your own risk .

Cliff

 

That's right - you are being paid rent for them being there. Either pull them into line or kick them out by informing them of their misdemeanours. They are using OP's parking spaces and indulging in regular shouting matches. Something's gotta give. You're the only one getting any benefit here.

 

No, you're not responsible for the actions of your tenants (generally) in relation to by-law contraventions. This is an issue between the body corporate and the occupier (ie the tenant).

Based on what you have said, any good lawyer will be able to get the body corporate off your back pretty quickly. Without going to this expense - this website may be helpful: Body corporate relationships explained | Residential Tenancies Authority.

 

Thanks for the info. Will pass onto managing agent.

 

Wow.

This is a bit hard to believe considering that the occupier has no contract with the body corporate, only the managing agent, who represents the owner.

Having said that, I'm not in Qld, but if an occupier decided to contest this relationship in a court, it would be very interesting to see what the outcome would be.

I understand that in NSW, a breach of strata by-laws is not a breach of contract of the residential tenancies lease, (although can be adjudicated by an NCAT determination) and your parking and noise issues would eventually be born by the owner, who is bound by the strata by-laws...

 

I agree.
I'd find it very difficult for an owner to be responsible for a tenants actions.
They're not babysitter or guardians.

Please let us know how it turns out.

 

I think what is being said here is that the owners corporation would take the occupier (those breaching) the by-law to the relevant body and possibly issue a penalty. The recourse is not likely to be effective - will take a long time.

However - it is a good position to take to ignore the issue if you are happy with the extra pets, noise and cars.

Is there some other issue with the strata? I mean you are 25%? Aren't you on the strata committee?

 

This is my take on this:

You as the Owner, appoint a PM, the PM then finds you a Tenant. The PM signs the Lease attached with a copy of By-Laws. The Tenants are to observe these By-Laws. In some Complexes, the By-Law is displayed in the Common Area such as Notice Board.

AFAIK, the BC do not deal with Tenants generally. BC deal with Owners which they have a relationship with. BC is not provided with details of Tenants so there is no relationship there. So Breach Notice (and Fines if it escalates) will go to the Owners, and it's upto the Owners to take the next course of action....

Well, the above are what I know as a general rule. It might be different if your Complex has a different set of rules.

 

I do not know about that, if you know your tenants are being a menace and wreaking havoc and you have been warned and ignore it, I think you may be sticking your neck out.

I would get them out if they are disruptive to neighbors as long as it is not a neighbor being malicious or just taking a personal dislike or other petty reason.

 

@Westnblue I think you should consider a number of posts in this thread, however for what it's worth, I suggest that you might ask the Body Corp "behalfer" that sent you the email in your OP, how many complaints have been made to the Owner's Corp regarding your tenants, and if they were in writing or not?

Depending on the response, and your consideration of the likelihood of continued timely payment of rent by your tenants given their alleged behaviour, including weighing up future neighbourly harmony, you might consider giving the tenants a Notice To Vacate (as you have "...decided to move back in...") or informing the "behalfer" that you are "...thankful for his or her help, and you will consider their comments carefully."

 

Hi, my 2 cents as a Queensland body corporate manager:

• Have you provided the name and contact details (i.e. address) of any occupier under a tenancy of more than 6 months in writing to the body corporate? (In my years managing hundreds of complexes, I can count the number of times this is done on one hand).
• If you have not done the above, the committee can infer that you are the occupier of that unit, because you have not told them that you are not. Notifying them that a property manager is engaged by you does not satisfy your obligation to notify the body corporate of tenants.
• If you notify the committee that there is an occupier that is not you, the committee must direct any contravention activities at the occupier (i.e. contravention for breach of the pet/parking/smoking by-law).
• Depending on the by-laws, you may still be breaching them. Many QLD schemes have a by-law that requires the owner of the property to take any available steps to ensure that any breaches by occupiers are ceased. That by-law, if it exists, would require you to issue breach notices to your tenants on the shortest possible timeframe, and a notice to leave if they do not comply. If you do not do what you can under the lease, then you would be breaching this by-law, if it exists.
• The body corporate cannot fine anyone. If a by-law imposes a financial liability on a person (i.e. if the by-law says fines can be made), then that by-law is illegal.
• If the matter is referred to departmental adjudication, the adjudicator may make an order (again, no fine, but they may order that someone repairs damages etc)
• If the person subject to the adjudicator's order breaches the order, the order can be enforced in the Magistrates Court and the Magistrate may impose a fine based on QLD penalty units, which at the moment is around $40,000.

That email from the body corporate manager is misleading (in my opinion), however you can still be on the hook for the actions of your tenants.

Matt