Best way to invest in a diversified index fund

Discussion in 'Shares & Funds' started by Frosty123, 7th Apr, 2024.

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  1. Frosty123

    Frosty123 Well-Known Member

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    Hi all,

    I've been doing a bit of research and would like to start investing regularly in a share portfolio for retirement. Currently in my mid-30's and have an investment property.

    I feel most comfortable with a passive investment strategy, and was looking at a range of index funds. I'm after a diversified high growth approach given my timeframe until retirement.

    I am leaning towards the VDHG or DHHF ETF's.

    However I would like a set and forget approach where 10% of my take-home pay is just direct debited from my account on a monthly basis. I would prefer not to pay the higher fees assosaited with a managed fund.

    Does anyone here have a reccomentation on the best approach? Am I best to just suck it up and get a SelfWealth account and pay $10 per month buying one of the above index funds each month?

    Thanks
    Frosty
     
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  2. ChrisP73

    ChrisP73 Well-Known Member

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    If you want to automate, try pearler. You could set this or any combination of ETFs up once and never have to lift a finger again.

    My teenagers (students with p/t jobs, businesses) are all setup 50/50 VAS/VGS and it's completely automated. They put their focus into study and work (and enjoying life) instead of worrying about investing minutiae :)
     
    Last edited: 7th Apr, 2024
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  3. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    If choosing Vanguard - the easiest way is to set up a Vanguard Personal Investor Account and buy directly through them.

    You pay no brokerage fees to buy Vanguard ETFs and a flat $9 brokerage fee when you sell. There are no portfolio management fees - just the regular ETF management fee (0.27%pa for VDHG).

    They have full auto-invest support as well.

    Just read the documentation carefully on their website - there are some gotchas at this point because the platform is so new and not all features are available yet. For example, you can't (yet) transfer ETF holdings from other brokers to your Vanguard Personal Investor account, and you can't trasnfer holdings out. This generally isn't a problem if you're looking for a long term buy-and-hold, and hopefully they'll get these features added in due course.
     
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  4. Ash11

    Ash11 Well-Known Member

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    I’ve just started with Vanguard for VAS and VGS.

    Minimum for auto invest is $200 (FN, monthly or quarter), and as they’re bought as full units any funds not used from the auto invest go to your cash account.

    Minimum for purchases from other deposits or your cash account is $500. So you would need to check in to see when you’ve hit $500 in the cash account to purchase shares if you don’t want the funds sitting in the account.

    No buy fees as mentioned, and a $9 sell fee.

    I’ve found the app very easy to use, need to use websites to track progress through the day/periods though, and will be setting up auto invest soon. Hope this helps
     
  5. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    One other gotcha with Vanguard - it's really easy to transfer money in, and I found transfers happen from my SMSF bank account (Macquarie CMA) within minutes - they even send you a text message when the money arrives in the account, which is great!

    However
    , my understanding is that you earn zero interest on any money in the cash account - which is presumably how they are making some of the money for the platform without charging portfolio fees?

    So not a great idea to park large amounts of money in the cash account.

    Other gotchas with auto invest:
    • Auto invest plans cannot be edited, you'll need to cancel them and recreate them to make changes
    • You can only have one auto invest plan for your account - but you can invest in multiple products at once
    • Investment transactions take 4 days after the scheduled regular deposit date
    • Managed funds can invest a minimum of $1, but ETFs are a minimum of 1 unit (you can only buy whole shares), so for example, VGS has an effective minimum purchase of $121.29 based on current share price - any shortfall will remain in the cash account until there is sufficient available to purchase a whole number of shares in a future cycle
    • You can't purchase non-Vanguard ETFs or ASX direct shares using auto invest
     
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  6. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    From the Vanguard Personal Investor Guide:

    The Interest retained on the Vanguard Cash Account is the difference between the amount of interest earned on the pooled cash held in the omnibus accounts at our authorised deposit-taking institution and the interest we credit to your Vanguard Cash Account (if any). This amount is calculated daily on the value of your Vanguard Cash Account balance and is received monthly by Vanguard before the Vanguard Cash Account Interest Rate to investors is declared (if any). It is not an amount that is deducted from your Account.

    For financial year ending 30 June 2023, the Interest rate retained on the Vanguard Cash Account was 1.04% p.a., and for the financial year ending 30 June 2024, the interest rate retained is anticipated to range between an estimate of 4.50% and 5.00% p.a.
    Given how easy it is to move cash into or out of your Vanguard Personal Investor account, I don't see a huge issue with this - keep your cash in your high interest bank account until ready to invest and then transfer it across or use auto invest. The amount of money left in your Vanguard cash account should be relatively small and thus interest lost won't be much.

    The only time you'd need to maintain a cash account balance greater than zero is if you hold non-Vanguard investments - the 0.10% pa of the value of those investments is deducted quaterly from your cash account.

    If using auto-invest to buy Vanguard ETFs, there will be amounts left over from purchasing whole units in the ETF that will remain in your cash account until the next auto-invest cycle at which point it is pooled with your next automatic deposit and applied to that purchase.
     
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  7. celsioraus

    celsioraus Well-Known Member

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    How does this platform go at tax time? how hard is it.
     
  8. Ash11

    Ash11 Well-Known Member

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    Sorry Frosty, I misunderstood about needing to manually invest the auto invest unused funds that are in the main cash account.

    You can also only buy up to 95% of your available funds from the cash account at least as Vanguard allows a buffer for fluctuations.

    Much better explanations and helpful to me also Simon, thank you. Especially pointing out the 4 days for reinvest funds to be available, I hadn’t read yet read everything re auto invest and might look at doing only manual deposits based on this.
     
    Last edited: 8th Apr, 2024
  9. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    I don't use auto invest yet - I've only had the account for a few weeks and am currently DCA'ing largish amounts manually into it every month or so from our pool of cash.

    However, once we've fully allocated that cash, I will be revisiting the auto invest - I'm undecided yet whether to continue investing manually or to use the auto invest function.

    I'm not overly concerned about the 4 day delay - I suspect it's to allow 2 days for the funds transfer to complete and then another 2 days for the investment to be complete.

    My main concern about doing it manually is forgetting or getting lazy - that's kind of the point about the autoinvest - you don't have to think about it. I don't think 4 days delay is going to make a huge difference in the long term for auto invest amounts.

    If you're autoinvesting $10,000 at a time and it would otherwise be sitting in a bank account earning 5%pa, you'll lose around $5.50 in interest by delaying 4 days. However, looking at the bigger picture - the markets only have to go up by 0.05% for you to make that money back, so it's not really a huge loss over the long term.
     
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  10. PCHouse

    PCHouse Well-Known Member

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    You'll be waiting a while for your tax statement. I found the whole platform a little outdated and slow. Coupled with non chess sponsorship, I then bit the bullet and moved everything to WBC. Sure, I could save on brokerage if I use Selfwealth or similar, but the platform and support are first class.
     
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  11. Frosty123

    Frosty123 Well-Known Member

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    It doesn't sound like Vanguard's is CHESS sponsored - meaning Vanguard's is the custodial of shares held.
    Is this a concern? In the very unlikely scenario that Vanguard's were to go under, what would that mean for the underlying holdings?
     
  12. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    From the Vanguard FSG (https://fund-docs.vanguard.com/AU-Vanguard_Financial_Services_Guide.pdf)

    Assets held by Vanguard Where Vanguard holds assets on your behalf through the Vanguard Personal Investor IDPS, Vanguard will hold such assets on trust for you. Where a sub-custodian is appointed to provide custody services in relation to certain assets, they will hold those assets on trust for us and we will in turn hold the interest in those assets for you. The role of the sub-custodian is to hold, maintain and deal with assets in accordance with directions received from us. The directions we give the sub-custodian will be based on instructions that we receive from you.

    Vanguard and any sub-custodian appointed by Vanguard may hold your assets in omnibus accounts pooled together with the assets of other investors. Records are maintained to enable the proper attribution of assets and income to you and each other client.

    Where you invest in the Vanguard Personal Investor IDPS, a Vanguard Cash Account will be opened for you. The cash held within your Vanguard Cash Account will be pooled with the cash balance of other investors and invested in bank accounts with Australia and New Zealand Banking Group Limited (ANZ). Vanguard receives a fee for managing your Vanguard Cash Account as described in the IDPS Guide.

    When you apply to invest in the Vanguard Personal Investor IDPS, you consent to the use of omnibus accounts by Vanguard and any appointed sub-custodian.​

    You can read more about Vanguard's use of custodian services here: Understanding the role of custodians

    For some additional interesting reading, some discussion about omnibus accounts can be found here:
     
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  13. Ash11

    Ash11 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks again Simon, much appreciated.

    I don’t like funds sitting not doing anything even if it’s a small amount. But this, and the cash account minimum spend are very small in the scheme of things as you pointed out, particularly given the .07 and .18% fees, no purchase fee and small sell fee for the 2 I’ve selected. TY, very much a newbie to this and still working on it