Engineered stone ban

Discussion in 'Renovation & Home Improvement' started by HappyBrizzie, 14th Dec, 2023.

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Justified or could have been better managed?

  1. Justified - no safe levels

    19 vote(s)
    54.3%
  2. Could be better managed

    16 vote(s)
    45.7%
  1. sakuraZen

    sakuraZen Well-Known Member

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    The 8-hour time-weighted average (TWA) workplace exposure standard (WES) currently (i.e. the current legal limit) for respirable crystalline silica (RCS) is 0.05 mg/m3. The limit of RCS you need to breathe in over an 8-hour day is about a match head of RCS. This equates roughly to someone asking you to find one pinch of salt in an office meeting room (~13 m3).

    A half-face P2 respirator will protect the person to 10x times the RCS TWA WES.
    A full-face P3 respirator will protect the person to 100x times the RCS TWA WES.

    You must have no facial hair for any close-fitting respirator to work. You must be fit tested for that respirator to ensure it works for your face ie. not just slapping on a mask and "she'll be right mate".

    Engineered stone workers can be exposed to levels over 400x times the RCS TWA WES if they are doing things like dry cutting or using dirty water to control dust generation. Why? Due to the bench top material being up to 95% RCS and the high energy process involved in cutting (remember the match head….). That means that even with correct PPE, there are still workers out there getting adverse health outcomes.

    What is the main issue here? The earth's crust is 90% SiO2 (silica). Most building materials will contain SiO2. When you cut cement, natural stone, mortar, tiles, bricks, fibre cement sheeting etc etc, you can create RCS in the process. It is about mitigating (or in this case, attempting to eliminate/avoid) the risk. Where Victoria has made an early mistake was in their definition of "Engineered or artificial stone" being >40% RCS so now there are "Safe" stone products with 40% RCS in them (still potentially going to cause harm).
     
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  2. Beerman

    Beerman Member

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    My $0.10 worth.
    I used to work in the CNC industry, which included Wood, Stone and Glass machines at a bunch of different end users inc Monumental Masons, cabinet makers, glass warehouses etc. I also used to go to the MDF plant in Gympie where it is made and have seen the process from start to finish.

    MDF; the Urea Formaldehyde glue is the problem with this stuff and the vapour it can give off in hot/very hot conditions can be dangerous in prolonged doses. The pine fibre is fairly course, but when cut and sanded can be an issue if you are succeptible to lung/respiratory conditions. Dust extraction machinery is generally capable of eliminating the hazard.

    Glass; apart from scoring and breaking down to smaller pieces, Glass is ALWAYS cut, drilled, polished etc. WET. No one needs to wear a mask in a glass processing factory because all dust generating activity is contained with water.

    Engineered Stone; see others posts re Silica content etc. However, plenty of 'Stone Masons' cut dry. Why?? 2 reasons. 1. It's quicker, hence cheaper and preferred by the boss, to dry cut. 2. Wet cutting involves systems/procedures to contain the mess, this is just another job very few want to do, I.e. lazy. It's that simple. I used to see approx 30% dry cutting at stone benchtop fabricators, even though wet cutting and grinding was available, that was in the late 2000's. They were in too much of a hurry to do it all wet. I also don't buy the argument about not being able to wet cut on site. Planning and preparation will take care of that. Apparently we can get a man to the moon, but can't come up with systems to contain high Silica content products..........

    Natural stone; see other posts re Silica content, handling etc.

    Corian; has a Korean brother called Staron, it has been around ~20-25 years and is a little harder than Corian. This is what we have in our 18 year old kitchen and would have it again in a heart beat. Wife thinks the same. The majority of fast food outlets use this type of product for their customer benchtop areas, with some laminate thrown in for tables etc. Behind the counter is typically all Stainless.

    Stainless Steel; Looks great when new, scratches are not repairable without some serious elbow grease or powered tooling.

    All products for benchtop / kitchen top use all have their pros and cons, with no particular product being a standout over another when considered holistically.
     
  3. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    Tile - preferably mosaic :D.
    406.jpg

    The Y-man
     
  4. Westminster

    Westminster Tigress at Tiger Developments Business Member

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    I think Corian will be back in vogue

    But also any of the Thin Tile Porcelain products. They are already around and need some mindset moves for installers to consider it more like glass/tile than stone. They are also great for having a matching run up a splash back wall

    Dekton have been around but there are many more coming on market. It's basically a giant printed tile so the options are endless
    Porcelain Slabs & Tiles Supplier in Australia | Fantaci
     
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  5. wylie

    wylie Moderator Staff Member

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    Our developer friend used a thin porcelain tile for his own splash back wall, looks like Calacatta marble, can't tell that it is a tile. He's also used it (not a marble look) in a ten townhouse development he did a few years back... looked amazing.
     
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  6. John R

    John R Well-Known Member

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    I visited a kitchen manufacturer on Saturday. They said that Caesar stone is coming out with a new product that has no silica? Not sure how accurate this is? or if it’s even possible?
     
  7. strannik

    strannik Well-Known Member

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    they have started marketing porcelain a while ago, not sure if that's what they meant: Caesarstone Porcelain collection | Caesarstone Australia
     
  8. John R

    John R Well-Known Member

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  9. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    @Beerman - great summary and couldn't agree more with you. Having had laid >000's m² of granite and marble, as well as been engaged in the procurement and processing of same it was virtually all wet cut even back in the 1980's for commercial projects. The only exception was when material was having heat treatment to exfoliate the surface.
     
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  10. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    Yep, those aiding and abetting including all homeowners & contractors who turned a blind eye for cutting corners (dry cutting, lack of enforcement, lax WHS etc) with the aim of achieving 'cheap' not 'safe'.
     
  11. Piston_Broke

    Piston_Broke Well-Known Member

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  12. Paul@PAS

    Paul@PAS Tax, Accounting + SMSF + All things Property Tax Business Plus Member

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    All the major engineered stone manufacturers are working on product mods to address silica removal. These also may yet be proven unsafe. Marble is a great example. May still contain high % of silica (not 95% but 5-50%) . And headstone makers have long been affected by silicosis before engineered stone was a thing. Sandblasting is also a process in steel fabrication and renewal and some car repairs.
     
  13. IrishInvestor

    IrishInvestor Member

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    Nice kitchen. Do you mind me asking how much it cost to put in? I am in process of assessing if I should put in entirely new kitchen or renovate existing
     
  14. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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  15. euro73

    euro73 Well-Known Member Business Member

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    It was several years ago and part of a complete interior renovation. I don't recall the costs.

    This is the company who did the joinery work for our kitchens and bathrooms
    Home - Living Edge Kitchens

    Sourced the Laminam here as they were the only retailer for Laminam at the time , although I think there may be others now. They referred us to the stonemasons skilled in working with Laminam. - Porcelain Panels Archives - Living Tiles

    Lights - Titan 5 Pendant Light. Black

    Appliances were sourced at various places. Winnings , Good Guys etc.

    If you have a company with ABN I recommend you register here to access wholesale pricing . You'll find a lot of these goods in retailers at a chunky markup so you can save a lot of money

    Statement Pieces To Inspire Any Interior | Australian Family Owned

    Florabelle Australia’s leading wholesaler of artificial flowers and trees, home décor, furniture and architectural lighting
     
  16. IrishInvestor

    IrishInvestor Member

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    Thank you Sir!