What do we think of the current Federal Government

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Chilliblue, 4th Aug, 2015.

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  1. datto

    datto Well-Known Member

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    He is just a narrow minded twit who backs big big business to the detriment of the ordinary Australian.

    Given half a chance he would screw the ordinary worker over and over again, and then display his big cheesy grin to the nation.

    The sooner this fella gets on his bike and rides off into the sunset the better we will all be. Budgie smuggler lol.
     
    datto, 11th Aug, 2015
    #41
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  2. shorty

    shorty Well-Known Member

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    Turnbull polls well with voters, but not within the party. Most likely replacement for Abbott, should he go, is Morrison.
     
    shorty, 12th Aug, 2015
    #42
  3. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    Until you said Budgie smuggler, I thought you were talking about Shorten. :)
     
    Perthguy, 12th Aug, 2015
    #43
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  4. Mombius Hibachi

    Mombius Hibachi Well-Known Member

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    ...but the Liberals are in power at the moment.
     
    Mombius Hibachi, 12th Aug, 2015
    #44
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  5. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    How did Labor go for ya's in the previous 6 years?

    Biggest resource boom in Aus history - and managed to rack up the biggest deficit in Aus history, Carbon Tax, 1200 boat people drownings and 50,000 in "detention" centres, 3 PM's....for starters.

    Everyone keeps forgetting that most of the probs the Libs now have were INHERITED.

    Things like the Pollie Perks, the Gay Sex Marriage debate, - all these little distractions are not new; just seized upon by the media and then blame is cast on the Gubb "for not focusing on the major issues".

    Global Warming - you can argue all day about how much the Gubb should pour into the pursuit of curbing GW and CC - and the Gubb are doing this; we are not the world leaders at it of course. It is arguable (and has been argued to death) that attempts to cut emissions will have any effect at all.

    TA has already stated that he supports renewable energy, but currently those jobs are heavily subsidised; meaning the cost of pursuing renewable energy options are - for the forseeable future - far too expensive. Without the subsidies most of those renewable energy incentives and programs would be closed down. It's all warm and fuzzy, but the economic reality is that they are not affordable given our current Balance Sheet and Profit and Loss statements.

    Labor voters want us to pour unlimited funds into the GW issue, pour unlimited funds into the renewable energy issue, cut the Deficit, provide more jobs and lower taxes for the workers; but half our revenue has disappeared.

    Also, given that the Gubb is trying to reel in the Deficit (virtually impossible now the resource boom has ended) it is a case of having to prioritise where the dollars are spent and where the dollars are saved towards that end.

    One of the things that is crucial to an economy which is strong and growing is for all businesses to be profitable and therefore to provide jobs. The Gubb has a responsibility to ensure that the economy as a whole is run this way....no business; no jobs.

    There are a million smaller factors at play amongst all of that, and no doubt some industries will not continue on the gravy train.

    How could Labor do any different? So far, all I hear is how crap the Libs are, but Labor hasn't come up with much to inspire folks.

    What we get instead is folks slagging off Libs, and liking Billy Bob more, and hating TA and JH - purely because Libs haven't waved a wand and fixed all the probs in 5 mins. :rolleyes:

    It's hilarious, and makes me shake my head that so many folks have such short memories.
     
    Last edited: 12th Aug, 2015
    Bayview, 12th Aug, 2015
    #45
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  6. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    Why are you ashamed, Sanj?

    What have they done which is so shameful? :confused:
     
    Bayview, 12th Aug, 2015
    #46
  7. AndrewTDP

    AndrewTDP Well-Known Member

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    How come the massive subsidies to coal miners are ok but subsidies to renewal energy are not?
     
    AndrewTDP, 12th Aug, 2015
    #47
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  8. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    I don't think they've done anything which is so shameful.

    They would have to do something first.
     
    geoffw, 12th Aug, 2015
    #48
  9. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    I think it boils down to the current costs - with or without the subsidies?

    From my understanding; when comparing the two options; renewables run a distant second.

    They are still pursuing renewables of course; but there has to be priorities in spending, and until the cost of a renewable can be decreased to the point where it is at the very least the same as the current, or cheaper than the existing selections, I think it will be less of a priority.

    No good continually pouring money into an area which is expensive when they have no money to begin with - and they don't have any money.

    You could argue the same about the submarine issue - yes; we want more jobs, but if the cost to build 3 is the same as the cost to build 9 at an O/S location; what do you do?

    We can build them here to appease the warm and fuzzy aspect and have more jobs; but the value for money is pitiful, and the priority with defence spending surely must be for....defence. 9 subs for the price of 3?
     
    Bayview, 12th Aug, 2015
    #49
  10. THX

    THX Well-Known Member

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    Every article I've read on the subject disingenuously includes things like normal tax deductions, diesel rebates etc that are available to all. If one side in an argument needs to start with a lie, I don't give much credence to that argument.

    As for alternatives to coal, nuclear is the only answer.
     
    THX, 12th Aug, 2015
    #50
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  11. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    I think it is in relation to the turning back of boats? Sanj can correct me if this is wrong.

    If it is the case; then they did do something in that regard. 1200 lives lost under Labor - none under Lib. Is this an improvement? I think it is.

    Whilst we all want to help refugees, we don't want to see folks dying on our doorsteps either. If you think that is inhumane to send them back (ultimately stopping the boats), then I am confused.

    Is it the best solution? noone has come up with one yet; other than to let everyone in (by plane) and then work on the processing later.

    Given we have a deficit which cannot be decreased; rising unemployment which requires more welfare to those who are out of work; how do you fund that option?

    On the topic of doing nothing; don't forget that so far the Senate has blocked a lot of what the Gubb has tried to implement.
     
    Last edited: 12th Aug, 2015
    Bayview, 12th Aug, 2015
    #51
  12. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    That's exactly what is happening with the other sort of migration which everybody has ignored. Visa overstayers.

    There are far more visa overstayers than people attempting to come in by boat. By their nature, these overstayers cannot work legally, so they have to work cash in hand. So there's tens on thousands of people working and not paying tax. Both my daughters, in different cities, had to work "illegally" because there was no alternative. As citizens they had to work at a much lower rate to work cash in hand, in order to be able to work at all. And they have actually declared the income to ATO, making them even worse off than the temp workers.

    As far as I know, no government from either side has seriously addressed this.
     
    geoffw, 12th Aug, 2015
    #52
  13. THX

    THX Well-Known Member

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    Visa overstayers are hardly comparable considering they are identifiable (required a passport and visa to get here) and the government has announced crackdowns.
    http://www.smh.com.au/federal-polit...g-illegally-in-australia-20141226-12dxod.html

    Why would your daughters have to work illegally? If they are declaring their income, then the ATO would be interested in why the business is not paying tax, unless they are being employed as contractors? Doesn't make sense?
     
    THX, 12th Aug, 2015
    #53
  14. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    That article was in December, and all the minister did was vow.

    One daughter made herself invaluable and insisted on being put on the books. The other had spent a part of the fy overseas, that may have been how she did it? I only know what she has told me.

    It's quite easy for somebody being paid cash to stay in the case economy and to stay under the radar. 62,000 of them do so according to the article you posted. The longer they overstay, the harder it becomes to do something about it.
     
    geoffw, 12th Aug, 2015
    #54
  15. THX

    THX Well-Known Member

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    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-28/immigration-raids-near-bundaberg/6654158 - recent story on their efforts.

    Ok, I'm not sure I understand the connection between visa overstayers and your daughters employment.
     
    THX, 12th Aug, 2015
    #55
  16. 2FAST4U

    2FAST4U Well-Known Member

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    2FAST4U, 12th Aug, 2015
    #56
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  17. THX

    THX Well-Known Member

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    Not a nice way to be sacked but I think based on the history of the Maritime Union the company was rightly wary of what sacked workers might do while on company property.

    A quote from a sacked worker illustrates clearer then any argument the entitled attitude of union members: "I have been working here as a stevedore for a year-and-a-half and thought I had a job for life.''
     
    THX, 12th Aug, 2015
    #57
  18. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    Actually, between people working illegally and visa overstayers. There are many backpackers who work cash in hand, and they are willing to work for any income (an employer making a profit would have to pay at least 30% less than normal for it to be worth while for them, as they would otherwise deduct tax for their expense). My daughters were living in areas where there were thousands of backpackers, many of them working illegally. So there's a big supply of workers willing to work cash in hand, and not a great supply of jobs. Only those willing to work for a low cash in hand rate were employed, and there were many of those.

    Many come with a visa which enables them to work, but under limited conditions- like a maximum of six months with one employer. Many of those choose to stay illegally with that employer.

    Personally, when I was an employer, I wouldn't employ anybody under those circumstances. First, it wasn't worth paying that much under the going rate. Second, I was in a high profile business. But also I have seen similar businesses for sale where the official figures put the wage expenses very low. I have actually advised people against buying those businesses. If the official figures showed 20% wage expenses, there was obviously something wrong, as the industry standard is 30-33%. It becomes obvious in the figures if there has been illegal payments.
     
    geoffw, 12th Aug, 2015
    #58
  19. THX

    THX Well-Known Member

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    Ok explains how it might be hard for her, the government has announced and are cracking down on them. I'm not sure what more can be done?

    Certainly the ATO could be monitoring these companies better if that is the case, as you correctly say they should know what the industry average is in terms of costs/profit.
     
    THX, 12th Aug, 2015
    #59
  20. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    Ok, so we don't allow refugees into the Country by plane - as one poster says is the lawful way, and recommends, and we don't allow refugees into the Country by boat - which saves their lives, but leaves other posters here ashamed and disgusted...

    How can we get them in and everyone is happy? o_O
     
    Bayview, 12th Aug, 2015
    #60
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