Sports & Fitness The Running Thread (All Abilities)

To be honest, I love it @Hodor

There's no way I'd be getting as much training in without it at the moment with the weather and having the dogs at work so I can't nip out during a work day easily this winter like I did last year.

I have it in a corner facing a wall in the spare bedroom, I've hung a TV right in front of it and ran Netflix to it, great way of catching up on doco's....

I'm putting 20-40k per week into it just now, a mixture of short shake out runs the day after a trail run and steady away 10k base k's on an evening.

I really like that you can concentrate on form, I've been practicing finding my cadence sweet spot and it's finally coming together. You can really experiment with technique and see in real time what it's doing to your heart rate for a given speed. I've found shortening my stride and upping my cadence, whilst feeling a bit alien to a loping long legged bounder like me, drops my HR by 6-7 points! Extrapolate that over 20-40k long runs and you can see how much more efficient the high cadence is. The treadmill is helping the legs adapt to the technique really well.

 

Thanks @Propagate interesting you have come full circle on the cadence thing, last I heard you weren't convinced. Getting a treadmill is the only way I'm going to be able to train a reasonable amount, few projects to get done first unfortunately.

 

Yeah, it's weird @Hodor my cadence has very slowly crept up a bit naturally over the last few months but being able to really concentrate on it on the treadmill has helped heaps. I'm still way off the 180 mark though, I'm up from around 135 to 155 so still a way to go. I definitely recommend one if you're time crunched, especially this time of year. It's easy to sneak in a quick workout and you can really tailor it to get the most from your time too. Leaves out any excuses not to go too, can't really blame a cold dark and wet night for not getting a run in anymore.

 

Hope everyone is still having fun with their runs. Still doing my regular/maintenance every 2 day 5 kms and it's been great keeping them to pretty much 18-19 minutes with no injuries at all throughout Autumn.
It's getting harder running in Victoria's cold Winter though especially at night after work but i guess that's one of the reasons why we all do it. Also been doing a fair bit of hiking pretty much every weekend which is a nice routine breaker from running.
One of my aims this winter running season is to do a few snow runs if possible!
Keep at it guys and enjoy.

 

Nice work @paulF 18-19 minute 5k's, wow, that's rapid.

I'm keen as for a snow run, we'll hit Donna Buang again as soon as there's report of snow up top.

I'm having a blast at the moment, averaging 40+ k per week just now and the difference in speed and strength the extra base k's have added is noticeable.

Went to a technique morning with Steve Moneghetti 2 weeks ago! That was fun and interesting. A personal trainer that works up near my mates place organised it for her clients then advertised it on Facebook to fill the seats. It was billed as 40 minutes technique and tips on the oval then an hours talk.

He's funny, his tips and techniques were simply to just run, run fast run far, run often and the rest will sort itself out. He doesn't stretch, doesn't do drills and doesn't pay too much mind to nutrition. He was running 200k+ a week when he was competing though.

The technique session turned out to be a Mona Fartlek session with the man himself. Man, that was tough! I bounced off 197bpm and averaged 193bpom for the 20 minutes. 350m laps of the oval for 20 minutes at Mona intervals, I went OK, stayed in the top 4 or 5 of the field and watched in amazement every time Mona silently sailed passed to lap me over and over....

Mona Fartlek

I've added one Mona Fartlek session per week into my routine and other than that just trying to log more k's where possible. I've been doing an hour on the treadmill most nights which gets about 11k in including warm up & cool down. I've been using that to really concentrate on form and get the cadence and speed up. It's been cracking weather to the start of winter so managed to get some good runs in outside too.

The Farlteks and base k training must be working, I ran a PB 10k on Friday and hit my first big goal of going sub 45 minutes. Came in at 44:51 which was over 3 minutes quicker than my last attempt. I also PB's my 5k during the same run at just over 22 minutes. Stoked with those times as I've been running for distance rather than speed, I think the Fartlek sessions and the hill repeats of the quarry have had the side effect of getting the legs stronger and the general speed up.

Backed that up on Saturday with a tough trail run, 28k from Bushranger Bay to Dromana, sensational weather for it. Smashed my last time on that route and pulled up pretty good at the end, (nothing left in the tank but not feeling broken like last time), then backed that up with a cruisy social 6k sandy trail loop last night with a couple of mates.

For anyone not following along from the beginning, I've only been running for 18 months, started in January of last year and could only run from one lamppost to the next. It was taking me 45 minutes to walk/jog the 4.5k to work. First massive goal back then was to be able to do 10k none stop, which felt impossible, then to break an hour for 10k so going sub 45 minutes has blown me away, not only that, but to do it then back it up the next day with a 28k rocky trail run with 750+ vertical meters boggles my mind. I'd never have thought I'd be capable of that.

All in all, a great weekend of running for me on the back of a couple of good, solid weeks.

Injury wise, still got that niggly hip & knee, not getting worse but can't fully get on top of it (and doubt I will unless I lay off for a couple of weeks). My lower back is shagged too just now, I think from a new mattress at home - it's way too soft. I wake up and crawl out of bed in a stoop, can barely bend to get in the car but by lunch time I'm 100%, this repeats daily hand has done since the soft mattress so I'm putting the old firm one back on which should solve it.

Hope everyone else had a cracking weekend?

 

Had another crack at the Vertical K up Mt Donna Buang yesterday, great fun. Bloody cold first thing but soon warmed up. Fair bit of foot traffic up there too being a public holiday. Knocked 25 minutes off my last go at it. Must be getting stronger! It's not particularly run-able (especially this time of year bring so slippy), only about 7-8k of the 21k would be running I'd say, the rest is practically climbing up and sliding down. It's murder on your quads on the way down, total rubber legs by the time I got back to the bottom.

Relive 'A filthy session up Donna'

I'm into the last week of the 10 week Ultra base building training plan then the 20 week Ultra plan starts next week which takes me right up to the week before the Ultra, looks like my k's start increasing a fair bit per week from about 2-3 weeks time. Going to be fun trying to squeeze the extra training in somewhere.

Anyone get a fun, interesting run in over the holiday weekend?

 

@Propagate , good luck with the upcoming volume hike.
I had a few plans until i got a cold! First time in many many years where i actually had to stay in bed and nurse it off for a day or too.

 

Bugger, hope you come good quickly.

Put an easy 5k on the treadmill last night by way of active recovery after the Donna run. Legs rebelled at first but felt much better for doing it afterwards, all set for a Mona Fartlek session tonight now ;-)

 

For Sydneysiders:

I’ve just done my first run with the Epping District Athletics club. Anybody wanting to join, they meet Thursday nights at Epping Oval and the nights start at 6.30pm. I only did a small run (about 4km) tonight (I had turned up a tad late for the start), but that’s ok. I jogged the whole way and I am happy with that. I had never been a runner. They mix it up so on other Thursday nights they’ll do other things.

They’ll also do a bush run on Sunday morning but it’s too early for me

Come and join me.... it’s free to jog with them.

 

Well, it's been a month of ups and downs for me.

First, the Ups:-

Started to up my training load now we're only 20 weeks out from the Ultra.

Mid June I smashed 15 minutes off my Trail Half Marathon time, pulling off a 1:41 on mixed trails in shocking conditions, (storm, gale force winds, rain etc). I was super stoked.

Backed that up with some low intensity treadmill volume and Fartleks.

Then another crack at most of the Two Bays trail with my running mate for November on Sunday the 23rd. Ran a 22k section then backed that up 4 days later by running the full Two Bays north-to-south 29k and 900 vertical meters. Pulled up well, felt strong the whole way. June was a good month.

A few social runs for the rest of the month and into the start of July.

Went out for my short fast run last night and ran a new 5k PB at 21:28. Ran an average 4:18 on my fast 7k trail route, super happy with that, that's the Farletks paying off nicely.

Now for the downs:-

Anyone following along might remember I've had a few injury issues since I started, the main one being lower back and hip. Well, it has not been getting better at all. No worse but always there. Bad in a morning, sometimes so much so that I can't get out of bed before doing 5-10 minutes of stretching in bed then I can't get my own shoes on or get into the car easily. By lunch time it loosens right off and by evening I'm 99% good. Go to bed, get up next morning and repeat.

Doesn't matter if I've had a hard run or a lazy day, neither seem to impact the next morning much Some days I'm just a little stiff when I wake up others I literally cannot get out of bed without help. Same in the night, some nights I go to bed fine and sleep right through, to then wake up sore, others I go to bed fine then wake up at 2am like someone is stabbing hot pokers into my spinal cord.

So I finally admitted defeat and went to the Docs last week. I have to admit, he had me worried, his first thought after poking and prodding me was Auto Immune disease!!! He orderd a raft of blood tests and an MRI.

I got all the results yesterday, it looks like I'm good on the Auto Immune, there's a less than 5% chance it could still be that. The bad news is I have a bulging disc at L3/4 (which I was kind of expecting, not a massive deal) but I also essentially have no disc left between L5/S1 and early degenerative change in the right SI joint (that's the hip issue then). I also have some bone fragments and cysts in there from where the body is trying (and failing) to heal itself.

The long and short of it is at aged 42 I'm essentially wearing out about 25-30 years too early.

It will never get any better, only worse. At some point in time it will become a matter of pain management.

At the moment he didn't seem to be too worried about the running. Just maybe don't run every day and stay off the pavement, stick to soft surfaces. Also ramp up the Yoga to strengthen the core and back muscles to provide extra support to the spine, try and protect it as much as possible and prolong what's left in there.

Bit bummed out to be honest. Off to the physio next week for some targeted strength exercises and advice on whether I can keep running. Other than that just carry on until I can't anymore.

I'm determined to break than 20 minute 5k barrier whilst I'm still able to push a bit and to complete the 60k Ultra in November, I'll take stock after that, see how we're traveling and maybe wind the runs off and get the bike back out. Until then, keep on keeping on.

 

Good to see your running is still going good @Propagate but also really sorry to hear about the discs and degenerative issues. Any reason why you're having those degenerative issues if i may ask?

As you said, don't let it slow you down but at the same time take care of yourself and would probably be a good idea to get a second opinion.

 

Thanks @paulF to be honest, I;d put off going to the Doc the last 6 months as I kind of knew deep down that's what it would be.

My Grandad, (mums side), struggled with his back for as long as I can remember, my memories of him as a kid were like what I am now, he was slow and sore on a morning and would come good later in the day. He never went to the Doc in his life, he kept himself active into his 80 and literally dragged himself out every day for a walk until he just couldn't do it any more. Once he stopped going out for his walks (well into his 80's) he just sort of gave up and passed away not long after.

My mum has had a shot back and neck since she was in her 20's, she had scans in her 30's which showed degenerative disc disease and bone spurs. They wanted to operate in her late 40's but the bone spur op was high risk as the spur was pinching one side of her spinal cord and the same vertebrae had a bulging disc pinching the other side. So she batted on as long as she could. She finally had no choice last year, the pain got to the point of getting no sleep and she was unable to walk more than 100 meters in the end. The choice was pain and a wheelchair, or operation that could result in a wheelchair anyway but at least most of the pain could be fixed. She went in and had the bone spur removed and her spine fused. Touch would it's worked really well, not 100% pain free but getting better and stronger every week.

So it's hereditary/genetic I guess. I'd say I'm ahead of the curve looking at where Mum & Grandad were at my age. I'd put that down to being active constantly since my 20's I'd guess?

Just a balancing act now, need to do enough to stay strong but not so much that it speeds up degeneration,

 

Propagate, very sad news about the running. If I was you I'd smash that 60 Ultra and then slow down. It's no use doing all this training if further on down the track you can't walk. Maybe you just need to scale it down into the future, nice leisurely 20 - 30 k runs once a week on a weekend and some cross training during the week. This might give you more years of running. I know the times I've been injured i'll run around an oval for a set minimum time, say a couple of hours, just to get off the road. I've also got a pretty good athletics oval here at Newborough and i'll do laps. It sounds boring but I just put the ipod on and get in a zone - feel great after doing a couple of hours.

 

Thanks @RS Gumby Indeed, that's the plan I think. I'll see what the physio says next week but likely my dream off a 100k run might be over. I'll do the 60 (hopefully) and go from there, maybe get back into riding again.

 

Looking at the daily time of day to pain ratio it seems very similar; start investigating your bed set up. Might need some adjustment or upgrading to keep spine in a neutral position.

 

It was definitely the bed that triggered it again this time. Soft beds have always been a killer for me, I need a very firm mattress. Ours was passed it's best so we tried the Koala one, it was awesome at first but after the first week or so is when the daily issues started. We gave it back before the 100 days free trial was up. Shame as it was super nice to sleep on. Went for the Ecosa instead which has 3 firmness adjustments. Firmest was like sleeping on the floor. Medium is the sweet spot. Not as nice to sleep on as the Koala but I'm a lot better in the mornings than I was on the Koala.

Feeling good the last few days, just a little stiff and pinchy on a morning but the yoga is loosing it up nicely. Also ran some of my fastest times the last three days and pulling up great.

First trip to the Physio tomorrow so we'll see what he says. Also just took delivery of the new Hoka Torents, hopefully a bit more cushioning will keep me running for a while longer yet.

 

I have started running!

Time to get fit and do some trail runs in the near future.

I have played sport, rode bikes but never actually run for a given period. My fitness is pretty ordinary at the moment and want to give the kids a run for their money!

3 runs down so far. Aiming for 30 min and so far combo of walk and run. My theory is 30 min works well of a night, then aim to cover more ground each time - less walking, then run the full 30 min.

3.5km, 3.9km and 4.6km tonight.

Im also using the kids and enrolled one in a kids 1km trail run on the weekend. That will get me around the people and the lingo. 6 year old loved the run and our 3 year old wants a go next time to which means I'll run with him

I have a huge thread to start reading though and i look forward to documenting some changes and also running some sort of formal run.

Also funny story so far. My wife told the kids i did something last night... my 6 year old said that i must have gone to grandpa's and borrowed his shoes!! haha they do the job and I've put it on the Christmas list

 

Good to see people are still jumping on board this running thing.

Propagate I look forward to hearing your ultra stories, been awesome hearing your progress and sorry to hear there's some struggles too.

I've been struggling with achilles tendonitis which is a PITA to recover from, finally started on complete rest from exercise for the past month, starting to feel better although I can feel it's still very inflammed and much thicker than the left one.

Injured myself skiing yesterday so now I'm stuck coffee in hand looking up at mountains covered in fluffy snow. Feels like a bad injury (long recovery), nothing much to do other than get back to Sydney and have a scan. Can't walk now so at this rate I'll be lucky to be running by Xmas.

 

I have a question, how do you all manage your breathing while running?

 

I don't even think about it to be honest. The more you train the easier it gets, especially for long distances. Ace in the Hole is a sprinter so he'd be able to shine more light on this.