Tenants without a lease

Discussion in 'Property Management' started by geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017.

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  1. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    Friends of mine let out their apartment to a relative (against my advice). They self managed, didn't have a lease and didn't have a bond. That has caused all sorts of problems, but that's another story. Now they've sold the place- the contract has just been signed. The people in there claim that they must be given 120 days notice. Where my friends stand?
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  2. Terry_w

    Terry_w Lawyer, Tax Adviser and Mortgage broker in Sydney Business Member

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    They have a lease. It is just not in writing so appropriate notice would be required probably.
     
    Terry_w, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  3. thatbum

    thatbum Well-Known Member

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    Hard to tell from here, but it potentially could be a periodic tenancy agreement - is 120 days notice the period of no grounds termination notice in that state?
     
    thatbum, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  4. thatbum

    thatbum Well-Known Member

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    There's a bunch of other possible scenarios as well, including that there is no lease and the "tenants" can be removed at-will. Really need a lot more relevant information.

    But why would they sell the house without any guarantee of getting vacant possession beforehand? What did they think would happen?
     
    thatbum, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  5. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    It's NSW. Do you know what the appropriate notice would be?
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  6. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    Why would they let a tenant in without a bond? Why did they self manage when they've barely ever even been tenants?
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  7. Terry_w

    Terry_w Lawyer, Tax Adviser and Mortgage broker in Sydney Business Member

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    Nope but you could find it in the residential tenancy act. It is 120 days I think.
     
    Terry_w, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  8. Terry_w

    Terry_w Lawyer, Tax Adviser and Mortgage broker in Sydney Business Member

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    www8.austlii.edu.au/cgi-bin/viewdoc/au/legis/nsw/consol_act/rta2010207/s86.html

    Could be as little as 30 days notice if selling property
     
    Terry_w, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  9. DaveM

    DaveM Well-Known Member

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    Nsw is 30 days notice on periodic lease on sale of property if vacant possessions required

    How long ago was the property originally leased to the tenants?
     
    DaveM, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  10. Ouchmyknees

    Ouchmyknees Well-Known Member

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    It proves once again that one should never have any financial dealings with friends or relatives.
     
    Ouchmyknees, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  11. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    Ah fantastic. Thank you so much Terry. You're a hero!
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  12. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    That was my advice. As well as the advice about getting it managed. Etc
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  13. Ouchmyknees

    Ouchmyknees Well-Known Member

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    If they only listen!
     
    Ouchmyknees, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  14. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    It was around 12 months ago.
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  15. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    Termination on sale - linky
     
    Scott No Mates, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  16. Xenia

    Xenia Well-Known Member

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    The fact that they are paying rent shows it’s an implied periodic lease agreement just not on paper.
    Same laws still apply as it was on paper.

    It can only be periodic if it’s an implied verbal lease.

    Nothing wrong with renting to relatives but manage it professionally including proper fixed term leases
     
    Xenia, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  17. Kassy

    Kassy Well-Known Member

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    @geoffw are they in Canberra? Notice here is 8weeks when selling if the tenant is on a periodic lease...
     
    Kassy, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  18. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    No, they are in NSW.
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  19. Beano

    Beano Well-Known Member

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    Did they charge rent to the relatives or was free as they were relatives ?
     
    Beano, 23rd Nov, 2017
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  20. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    They charged rent. However the tenants behaved like prima donnas, withholding rent many times because things weren’t working.
     
    geoffw, 23rd Nov, 2017
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