Tenants damage newly installed pavers

Discussion in 'Property Management' started by chibs, 3rd Jan, 2016.

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  1. Phantom

    Phantom Well-Known Member

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    That's a terrible job also. No sand between the pavers. Gaps should be between 1 and 3mm and brushed over with sand to close gaps and create bond. Edges have very thin 'mortar haunching' which is why they have broken off and pushed aside. Read Section 2.207 of the Boral manual that Scott No Mates posted. It shows the edge restraint requirement for a driveway. It obvious that both this and the OP's are not of the correct standard.
     
  2. Big Daddy

    Big Daddy Well-Known Member

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    I will chase the builder for this. Can I get an independent inspection done to give weight to my argument or just threaten legal action ? What about mentioning I will contact HIA ?
     
  3. bob shovel

    bob shovel Well-Known Member

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    They've had a good go but no way that conc will do anything in sand like that. The heave from the weight of cars would do that easily.
    The handbook Scott linked shows the correct way. It's straight forward to fix the pavers but they need a heap more concrete on the edge to stop it moving outward
     
  4. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    HIA is a Builders Association ie provides support for the builder, Fair Trading or Consumer Affairs protects consumer rights.

    The photos that you posted show that the mortar around the edge of the paving is way too thin and doing absolutely nothing to retain the edges.
     
  5. WestOz

    WestOz Well-Known Member

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    Allot of posts to catch up on

    The edge mix has too much sand in it, lets it crack/crumble easy, + its been laid way to thin, budget job, materials cost the installer $'s, takes time to mix etc...

    Regardless it wouldn't have stood up to the lack of pre lay prep, i.e. wet down and thoroughly compact past the point of final brick (not to it) prior to screed/lay.
    Then backfill/compact over the edge so there's at least a foot of same level (or higher) ground from the edge to avoid collapse. (this is whats also lacking with yours Batman)

    Like most things any Nob can throw/rake some sand around, stager pavers, can look great when finished, until it's used as intended.

    And what's the go with two and a slice in the bottom corner of pic 2, did their saw breakdown or something? Why's it not squared off?
     
  6. chibs

    chibs Well-Known Member

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    I feel you BigDaddy. The builder will say the job was completed and signed off, point to tenants, will not fix it. It's difficult to get them to fix anything once they received your money. You need to be able to prove your argument. Good luck to you.

    As WestOz said, as noobs we trusted the contractors to do their job properly. Looked fine when we inspected it. At that time the concrete hasn't dried off so we signed off the job before doing any load testing.
     
  7. SeafordSunshine

    SeafordSunshine Well-Known Member

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    Ask Fair Trading?

    (Not sure about the WA dept name though),
    I hope this helps
     
  8. magpieseason

    magpieseason Well-Known Member

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    The corner in the second pic is hilarious . The strange thing is that both header courses could easily have joined perfectly.

    Both jobs seemed to have been haunched with mortar instead of concrete. Big nono for drives.
     
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  9. Azazel

    Azazel Well-Known Member

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    Need to find the relevant body in your state, could probably find out from Fair Trading.
    In QLD it's the Queensland Building and Construction Commission.
     
  10. Big Daddy

    Big Daddy Well-Known Member

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    Email Sent: Maybe the OP can use some parts of this email ... i hope its written correctly


    Regarding the driveway paving, If you take a look at the Boral technical manual on page 90 under the heading ‘Edge Restraints’ you can see the typical types of edge restraint systems used in paving.
    http://www.boral.com.au/bricks/brick_technical_manual/_Technical_Manual_Whole_09.pdf

    If you compare it to the photo of our driveway you can see the edge restraint is well below the standard required and the mix has too much sand in it which lets it crack/crumble easy. It has been laid way to thin (very thin haunching) and the edge mix also seems to be mortar instead of concrete . Additionally, there was a lack of prelay prep i.e. wet down and thoroughly compact past the point of final brick (not to it) prior to screed/lay. They should have backfilled/compacted over the edge so there's higher ground from the edge to avoid collapse.

    We are very happy with the quality and speed of the dwelling build and the excellent communication by staff but were a bit disappointed with the paving and we would the like the complete length (Verge to turning circle) of the edge restraint system on the driveway to be reinstalled as to the correct standards. If the builder would like to meet onsite to see the quality of the work then I am happy to meet them anytime.
     
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  11. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    Have you used Boral pavers? Or substituted something else so you need to refer to the appropriate specifications.
     
  12. Marg4000

    Marg4000 Well-Known Member

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    Years ago hubby's parents bought a brand new home with a paved driveway. Only ever drove their little Toyota on it. Edges were fine, but the car wore sunken tracks on it and it looked dreadful.

    They pursued the builder through Qld entity at the time and the builder was ordered to relay the pavers on a thicker base.

    When the rectification work was carried out the builder admitted that driveway pavers should always be laid over a concrete base!

    And from your photo, it looks as if the pavers are laid higher than the floor of the house which may cause flooding problems in heave rain??
    Marg
     
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  13. Big Daddy

    Big Daddy Well-Known Member

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    Builder will fix. Thanks for everyones help and also Metrostrata
     
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  14. Azazel

    Azazel Well-Known Member

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    Good to hear.
    Were they cranky?
     
  15. MRTLR1000

    MRTLR1000 Active Member

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    having been a landscaper for years..the yellow sand , is that brickies sand?.if it is..wrong sand and will turn hard and to ridgid and pavers will crack. .the pavers are to high compared to ground height. The mortar around the edge is not used to hold the pavers in, its a decorative edging. The very least it is an edging to hold pavers shape as long as its on firm ground, not sand..of course it will crack and move...no support for the mortar..to much movement. At the end of the pavers, you should put a timber sleeper across and add supports to hold pavers in....lay the bricks up to the timber support. To much weight, and its been brushed with sand. you need a wet slurry which is sand mixed with water and hosed and brushed in. once finished, cars should not go on it for up to 3 days...did they whacker the road base?. good its being sorted, but if you dont put a support across front, a years time, it will be the same
     
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  16. Big Daddy

    Big Daddy Well-Known Member

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    No not at all. Instead of threatening them i made them want to live up to their repuation and make good.

    I started the email with praise about their work and good communication and fast build time and how it was a shame (and i was a bit disapointed) only with the paving.
     
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  17. Plucka

    Plucka Well-Known Member

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    A concrete base under paving is preferable for vehicle traffic but roadbase/sand can be used as long as the roadbase is 150mm+ thick and adequately compacted using a plate compactor. If they skimped on this then you are guaranteed the pavers will sink over the years.

    Your immediate problem though is the **** poor concrete haunching holding the edge of the pavers. It should be substaintially thicker with surrounding earth built up to same level ideally not a drop off like you have. However I note that you mentioned they were driving it on immediately? Possible the concrete had not cured yet and was too weak, driveway should have been taped off to not allow any cars for a least a week or two to allow curing.
     
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  18. Plucka

    Plucka Well-Known Member

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    Actually it's called haunching,
     
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  19. D.T.

    D.T. Specialist Property Manager Business Member

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    Coping here, most terms vary per state.
     
  20. Phantom

    Phantom Well-Known Member

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    Yep. I think coping is mainly for pools.
     

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