So what will happen to modern apartments in 30-40 years?

Sorry but didn't know where else to put this question.

Unlike Europe and North America, Australia has a relatively short history of apartments (as opposed to flats).

2-3 storey 1960-70s style brick flats are everywhere in most Australian cities, and they still remain a popular form of accommodation in many parts of our cities, primarily for young people but not necessarily.

But what about 4-6 storey modern apartment buildings, say of 1990-2010 vintage?

These are different from flats in that they were built as semi-luxury residences, with lifts, and a floor plan with generally larger proportions, with larger balconies, often with multiple bathrooms, and basement undercover car parking. They often have facilities such as gyms, pools, and even community spaces including rooftop gardens. Most are security complexes with swipe-key access.

So what will happen to these when they reach 30-40 years of age?

I am asking because I have been looking at houses in Sydney for 7-8 months, but have recently come to realise that houses in the areas I want to live are out of reach for me. I could buy an old crumbling house requiring significant renovation, for the sake of better future growth potential compared to apartments. But I want modern open-plan living, train access and proximity to shopping and dining options that a suburban house won't get me.

So I have turned my attention to 3-bedroom apartments, as a place to raise my small family (of 3).

Most of these apartments offer security car spaces and easy walking distance to the train, with shopping and dining options nearby.

I have been looking at apartments that are 10-15 years old.

But I can't stop wondering what they will look like in 20 years time if I want to sell.

I guess it depends on lots of things like quality of strata management, the neighbours, the builder/developer, the area etc, but does anyone have general predictions about what these modern apartment buildings will be like when they get old?

Will they become liabilities that are hard to get rid of, losing much of their value? Will new apartments show up these old ones pushing their value down? Will they turn into 'ghettos' - a claim often made by critics of over-development in our cities?

Would appreciate your insights.

 

Let this be your guide.

• don't buy into a block that has more than 20 apartments
• buy in a block that is at least 30-40 yrs old ie K.I.S.S and buy an older apartment. I wouldn't buy anything newer. In GENERAL, the build quality is subpar compared to the older stuff.
• quiet street
• N/E aspect
• 1 or 2 LUGs
• top floor or ground floor - apartments with private courtyards on title are worth gold but even a shared yard is still something
• if its a 3 bedder, make sure its > 85 sqm internally not including the garage

 

Based on experience elsewhere where apartment blocks became common over 50 years ago, these are the problems when such buildings reached 50+

- Concrete cancers. Steel in concrete rusted out and weakened, concrete falls in slabs and rendered key structure failure.
- Replacement of water and drainage infrastructure, not cheap!
- Replacement of transport infrastructure, lifts, etc., very expensive
- Replacement of fire safety infrastructure, again, not cheap
- Water and weathering damages. Micro-leakages with no known causes, and no permanent cure.
- Change in residency demographics. Might become a ghetto as less people want to live in an old apartment block
- Major headache with body corporate membership, too many self-interest and often lead to disagreement on building-wide maintenance and policies. Endless dog-fight among members.

 

Thanks but 30-40 year+ old apartments often do not have the features I want, such as security building, modern layout with fittings. Also in my experience buildings with less apartments tend to have more expensive strata fees, as admin fees are shared by less lots. My last apartment had 20+ lots and it was okay but not cheap.

As for 3 bedders having more than 85sqm internal, I didn't think it could be any less.. my last 2 bedroom apartment had about 98sqm internal, and the one I'm looking at now is 105sqm+ internal.

Agree on N/E aspect and quiet street.

 

It's an untested and developing market. You've pointed out of the important points (location, size, facilities, transport, shops etc) - these things won't change over time (the station/shops/schools etc won't be moving), it made demand for houses in these areas, now units.

Yes, the units will have aged but so have the houses. There is an obligation on the OC to maintain the building and facilities.

Older, well located, smaller blocks of units require only 75% agreement of owner's to sell to developers which will pave the way for these to be redeveloped.

 

Yeah I guess each to their own but I'd rather buy something older and renovate rather than a newer product. Best of both worlds is to buy a townhouse if your budget can stretch.

 

I cannot comment on multi-level apartments as I have no experience with them. However my own townhouse (two storey) and my mother's villa (single storey) units are both somewhere between 30 and 40 years old. They are in very good condition and well maintained. The strata fees at my TH are very low. There are only five units and most are owner-occupied, so the owners treat the building very well. There are no expensive pools, lifts and other common areas to clean, maintain and sterilise every day.

 

Why top floor or ground floor and nothing in between? curious

 

I was living in a 10 year old apartment block. Full of cracks, dodgy non-legal plumbing, water leaking into the garage every time it rained, leaking balconies and more. I would never do it again. If you do, make sure you do your due diligence.

 

Noise and possible plumbing issues from upstairs predominantly. Ground because you trade that off with a segment of the market who can't traverse stairs - parents with babies, older people, people with disabilities etc.

 

Only those who haven't lived in an aged high rise apartment block would choose top floor and ground floor.

Top floor problem. Unlike a house, apartment blocks top floor only have a piece of concrete separating the roof and your ceiling. It would be significantly hotter in summer as there is literally no insultation and concrete releases heat after sunset for a long time. So, you get a " radiator" in your ceiling, in summer. When aged, the water resistant layer of the roof starts to leak. You have a perpetual seeping problem. As it only affects the top floor apartments, you need to convince the body corporate to use its sinking fund to repair for you. That's fun. Also, a lot of public utilities are on the roof. You might have noise and other annoyance.

Ground floor problem. As the whole building sewage is collected on the ground floor. If there is a blockage, the burst will happen on the ground floor and of course the ground floor apartments have it. Also, there might be sub-stations built on the ground floor and you might be living just next to the sub-station. If there is a courtyard, you might end up collecting rubbish throw out of the windows from other floors. One occasion I know is someone jumped out of the windows to commit suicide and landed on the ground floor courtyard. Ambulance has to go through your home to retrieve the body.

For high rise apartment blocks, the best floor is the second last floor from top. You have got your upstairs apartment to help with heat insultation but the best view because of the height. One on the corner of the block to give 270 degree view.

 

Cheers thanks for the insight - never bought apartments before

 

Not all high-rise have flat roofs, often there may be a plant room, chillers, air handling units, lift motor rooms, water tanks for sprinkler systems etc or a pitched roof.

More often than not, there would be basement parking and this would be going to the basement rather than the ground floor.

The higher up in the building, the fewer people coming to the floor however you are next to last when the priority comes for the lift.

 

Detonate and redevelop

 

That's what I bought: the view was stunning from the Bolte Bridge, across the Melbourne CBD and down the bay to Frankston and beyond. But it was being on a corner [with the height] that made it so windy, and thus effectively unusable for most of the year.

 

+1 to Spoon's comment about avoiding top floors. Lived in a 7 story building on top floor. Utilities like air con and ducting fans are on the roof, which means they're about 3 inches off your ceiling with no insulation or sound proofing between. Our building had internal bathrooms with vents that ducted up through a fan on the roof. Nightmare, and impossible to dampen.

One of my IP's is a high rise with pool and gym and all that stuff, bad asset for all reasons mentioned, will offload when practical.

 

I was referring to two or 3 storey walk ups built before the 80s.

 

Ghettos?

 

Ghetto on the mid north shore? Seems unlikely.

but the unknown is how well (or not) those newer building will hold up. Will they need significant repairs etc?

Maybe just see it as a stepping stone to a duplex or house?

 

All those towers in Redder, Waterloo, Ermington, Mt Druitt etc were once new too.

Spoiler: Ghettos

Oh, they haven't changed