Replacing old electrical fusebox

Hi there,

My property manager, after instituting the usual checks, received a report from Detector Inspector about an issue, as detailed in the below screenshot.

It is still compliant, they concede but still presents risks. It's for an IP in Ballarat, VIC.

Does anyone know if this is a legitimate problem with high risks or just an attempt to lead me along the path of over-capitalisation?

Many thanks!

 

After reading that it puts a shiver up my spine ,no safety trip out and the old style box..

Only my simple opinion as if this way in QLD ,and the Property Manager was up to date on the laws
then you would not even risk the predetermined out come and list the property on the open property market..

Then the insurance would say ''No Can Do'',and your facing a manslaughter sentence ..

I would call a lic-sparkie yesterday what ever the cost as this is like playing Russian Roulette only every bullet in the chamber is primed ..imho..

 

Sounds pretty dire. I am waiting on an updated quote before I proceed, and am leaning this way. Note though that the old fusebox is considered compliant.

 

Lets just say the copper fuse wire at the permissible resistance level at 20/C OHMS/M is replaced with a nail at the diameter 2-50 mm and the board starts to burn as the nail will keep the board active what do you think will happen?..
btw i have zero qualifications in this line of work and the ''PM'' may be missing the essential point ,this could kill everyone within that rental property..

Hopefully some of the more skilled in this line of safety within this site will explain ..good luck ..imho..

 

I reckon by the time they quote the safety switch, they'll find a whole bunch of other things that need upgrading. Some older places need full rewiring, which can be an expensive proposition.

Depends what your plans are for the property..

 

It is a simple job to switch the fuses for circuit breaker switches (not sure if that is the correct description) while you decide whether to upgrade the switchboard. (A sparky did that for me for free when he came to quote me for something else).

However, you should definitely get RCDS and fix the earth. From memory RCDs might be required in the next couple of years in the new tenancy legislation in Vic anyway.

The switchboard is compliant now. However if you need any electrical work done, it will need to be brought up to modern day standards then.

 

My Ballarat house (built 1975) had a board like this - I was amazed to see it, since such primitive switchgear was obsolete in UK by 1950s and would have been condemned several decades ago. I didn't think twice about having it replaced.

 

I see a lot of ceramic fuses and until electrical upgrades are required (not just swapping out existing) I believe they are considered compliant - in NSW at least. In my experience to upgrade the box with RCDs is about $900-$2k depending on number of circuits, location of box etc

 

It's worded (only) as a 'recommendation' and is described as 'not safe' but is still compliant?

If it really was 'not safe' the electrician would be required to disconnect the property - no ifs or buts, it 'must' be repaired and cannot be reconnected until that is done.

 

There are changes to the Vic rental laws that mean all circuits must have protection from a safety switch.

so even tho it is compliant with the electrical standards and safe, it won’t be compliant with the new rental laws.

There are lots of acronyms in the electrical world, rcds, mcbs, etc

but, the ones you want to get are rcbo’s

Think of a rcbo as a circuit breaker and safety switch all in one.

The reason to use a rcbo over a circuit breaker and safety switch combo, is that the Australian standard only allows one safety switch to cover three circuits. Each safety switch also takes up one space (pole) in your fuse box. Also, if it trips, you have three circuits that could be causing you an issue and it means you have two circuits down, whilst you find out whats wrong with the faulty one.

On the other hand, rcbo’s do not require safety switches, so that saves costs there, they save space due to not having to house the safety switch and if there is a fault on a circuit, it’s only that circuit that goes down.

Rcbo’s are only about $30 per circuit for a good brand as well.

 

The new Vic Regs start in March 2021 (after a years delay) and its possible no sparkie will sign off that board and outlets as "safe". Its not overcapitalising to fix old and defective issues. Its maintenance and a responsibility. You should have known this was a defect when acquired if a pest & building report was obtained. Its likely deductible as a repair since the defect is triiggered by Vic state law compliance rather than a supply "defect".

Maybe a job to outsource for quotes rather than rely on the agent and their provider. HiPages ? Images of board may assist. You want it to be rental compliant.

 

My first PPOR had ceramic fuses and I had them replaced with RCBOs fairly promptly. My current PPOR has a single RCD protecting multiple circuits and when it trips it takes everything out. Maybe I will replace it one day, but at least I am protected. I believe that my rental properties are the same as my PPOR (annoying when tripped, but still protected).

As per the electrical regulations, earth leakage protection has been introduced progressively over the last 30 or 40 years. Initially it was OK to have your fridge on a non protected circuit (they used to trip them), later it was OK for lights to not be protected. The current regulations require every final circuit in a domestic installation to be earth leakage protected (this requirement is only a couple of years old).

The electrical regulations have never been retrospective, meaning that if an installation was compliant when installed then it does not need to be updated unless new work is done. So there are many very old installations around which are quite legal, but are nowhere near up to the current standards. Note that an installation still needs to be maintained, and so something that was legal can deteriorate to a point where it is no longer legal.

On the other hand, many states have introduced laws requiring these sorts of safety measures when renting (or selling, depending on the state), which has resulted in many old installations being upgraded (a good thing IMHO).

As an electrical engineer, I wholeheartedly endorse their recommendation of installing safety switches/RCBOs/ELCBs (or whatever you want to call them) as they significantly reduce the consequences of the majority of electric shocks. Any sparky should be able to quote on these and they shouldn't be too expensive (although they may be required to bring other parts of your installation up to the current standards)

 

Good post.

There is more to it then just leaving the old panel which in nsw is 100 percent of the time asbestos and putting rcbos on every circuit.

to do a proper upgrade you need to be installing a new main earth stake, new mains , new metering , current limiting CB as a main switch.

most common folk have no idea of the cost and would balk at spending 2 to 3 k to completely install a new board which would be compliant for the next 20 years. But on the other hand couldn’t walk out of the good guys quick enough with that new ice making fridge

 

HI
We paid $4,480 + GST = $4,928 (Power pole upgrade, relocations of meter box, Meter / box upgrade and 3 Phase upgrade.
So worth the cost, reliable power and when we added Solar no upgraded needed