Religion and sexism

Most religions are male dominated and have centuries or more of history behind them. Even in more progressive religions sexism and discrimination does exist. This isn't going to change overnight or even quickly but in many regards it is changing. You can't single out any particular religion on this unless it's a very young religion (perhaps Scientology, but I know nothing about it).

I'd agree that Islam has been far slower to change than most religions. The Palestinians can say they were in Israel before the 1950s, but most of Palestine didn't have running water at that time. It was the Jews, not the Muslims that modernised the region. I think this conflict has gone beyond a religious one however.

Sexism and discrimination does occur in general society, it occurs in religion, but it occurs at every level of society. The difference is the rest of society is more flexible and adapting new attitudes faster than any religion can.

We also need to remember that there will always be some segregation on the basis of gender. From a practical perspective men and women are different, this is basic biology. I watched a Vsauce video on uTube yesterday that explained this quite well.

Through through procreation men can produce almost unlimited offspring. It only takes one sperm to fertilise an egg and men generate millions every day. Women have a limit number of eggs they can produce in a lifetime. This simple biological fact means that one sex is more predispositioned to spreading their genetic material, whilst the other is more selective about with whom they procreate.



This means that men and women do have differing attitudes towards each other and their overall roles in society. It doesn't mean that men and women are not equal, but rather they should be treated as equals with varying strengths.

Another study I read indicated that through the use of science (and also in some animals), mens primary role is to simply provide sperm for reproductive purposes, beyond this men are essentially redundant to the species. Some species don't need males to reproduce (they're essentially all female) and via IVF humans are now able to emulate this.

The study went on to explain that they've tried this is in lab conditions using mice and rats. They did notice that across multiple generations, the genetic diversity and quality of the test population was declining.

As my wife suggested, men do appear to be useful for things other than opening jars and dealing with spiders.

 

Not true. Even female graduates start on lower salaries than men in mAny industries.

Ive seen some good australian data but i dont have time to find it at the moment. Heres an article on the gender pay gap amongst graduates in the UK.

http://www.theguardian.com/careers/careers-blog/graduate-gender-pay-gap-university-subject

My husband recently took over a team of managers earning 100k+. He gave the only female a 20k pay rise and told her she was being paid less than her peers and would have to negotiate better in future. I dont think any of the team had children yet, certainly not the woman who was being paid less than her male collegues.

The Gender pay gap exists before women take career breaks.

 

My fiancee and her best friend made more than all of the other Senior Accountants (who were all male) at her firm before she left, because they were the best accountants. They tried to offer her more when she resigned too.

We could post anecdotal evidence all day to support our arguments.

I'd be interested to see the Australian data, but I highly doubt it would be comparing apples with apples, because feminists would be plastering the internet with it if it did.

 

absolutely. always irritates me when i see some redneck idiot online refer to burqas like they're commonplace in australia, 99% of the time they're referring to niqabs.

if someone is going to commit to be a badly spelling bigot you'd think they'd at least know what they hated.

 

Whatever. It's high time they moved forward several thousand years, yes?

 

We did not come from an affluent background, but my mother taught me:

1. Don't discuss religion
2. Don't discuss politics
3. Table manners, such as holding your knife and fork correctly. So even if you are a pleb, you can not be embarrassed to east amongst the privileged folk.

But seriously, on points 1 &2, they cannot be logically debated with people because the emotions are too deep ****** in people. So I respect all peoples views and religion but decline to comment on all of them..

 

Have you?

 

well, I would like to think I have; my wife is free to wear what she wants, go wherever she wants, talk and visit with whoever she wants. She is an equal to me, in my eyes.

Eventhough I am not religious, and don't agree with a lot of what many religions deem as sensible practices, I don't persecute or exclude folks because of their religion...as long as they keep it to themselves and don't try to sell it to me.

That'll do for starters.

 

Good job. Seems like your deeds have, words haven't. Ask the same question to 3 more people and make sure they have moved forward too. Ask them ask 3 more each and so on and so forth. The World will be a happy place soon.
Ta

 

you are absolutely correct.

Imagine how much more peace and harmony the whole world would have if everyone moved forward into this century.

 

Yea everyone would be too precocupied with taking the perfect selfie and what the Kardashians are up to to fight each other

 

I dont know which part of the internet your hanging out on, but im not hearing any accademics, politicians, journalists or economists disputing the gender pay gap.

http://m.smh.com.au/national/tertiary-education/gender-pay-gap-doubles-in-a-year-20130103-2c78q.html

Its not just feminists who are concerned about the drag on productivity caused by the gender pay gap. Sure, career breaks for child rearing explains a lot of it, but not all of it. And even if babies was the total cause of the GPG, theres still a lot more that can be done to even out the playing field.

 

My wife earns more than me, which is especially disturbing because I'm the one paying her salary.

 

@juzzy out of interest, how do they know how much everyone else is earning?

 

You're rigging the stats mate

They're accountants, they prob have access to the payroll.

 

Nope, women don't get paid more than men.

Sill waiting for the usual suspects to throw around the 'misogynist' word.

 

When I was at my last employer and started out in a new role my male work mate in the same position as me got paid more as he was more experienced. By the time I left I was getting paid more as I was better at the job which was reflected in my performance reviews and subsequent pay rises.

 

Esel, the gender pay gap claim has been argued thusly:

Feminists take the average wage of all men and all women, which shows that women earn about 77 cents *on average* of what men do. They then use that as an argument that women are paid less than men *in the same positions* because they are women, which is ridiculous to the point of ignorance.

Firstly, it's illegal and if it was accurate, there would be a line a mile long outside courthouses of cases where women are suing their employers for pay discrepancies. There is no argument that there is an actual pay gap, however it has nothing to do with gender discrimination.

What they don't take into account is the many variables that result in the gap. For instance, some of the variables are:

• Men work longer hours
• Are more inclined to travel for work
• Work in dangerous/life threatening jobs (men make up 96% of workplace deaths)
• Are more willing to sacrifice time with family for work
• Women gravitate towards positions in which they have more flexibility, so they can have more time with family (which results in lower pay)
• Women that have the choice, prefer not to work or to work part time (from this article: http://ideas.time.com/2013/09/04/do-women-really-want-equality/)

"Unsurprisingly, according to surveys, women who become doctors approach their work differently than men. They spend more time with each patient; when choosing jobs, they are far more likely to cite time for family and flexible hours as “very important” and to prefer limited management responsibilities. Male doctors, on the other hand, are more likely to think about career advancement and income potential.

This hints at the problem with the equality-by-the-numbers approach: it presumes women want absolute parity in all things measurable, and that the average woman wants to work as many hours as the average man, that they want to be CEOs, heads of state, surgeons and Cabinet heads just as much as men do. But a consistent majority of women, including those working full time, say they would prefer to work part time or not at all; among men, the number is 19%. And they’re not just talking; in actual practice, 27% of working women are on the job only part time, compared with 11% of men."

For instance, a study done recently shows that the pay gap is widest in first world countries, because women either work part time or not at all, because they can afford to do so.

All of these variables (plus many more), when taken into account, reduce the wage gap to almost non-existant.

The fact is that the gap exists because of choices that women make, not because they are discriminated against because they are women. If women want to get paid more, then they can spend more time at the coal face and compete for higher paying positions with the men. I hear arguments from women that they can't negotiate as well as men or aren't as competitive, therefore they miss out on higher paying positions. Well, so what? Then learn to negotiate harder and be tougher. All this 'Ban Bossy-esque, my poor feels, we need to enforce quotas' crap that gets thrown around doesn't do women any favours.

I hear all the time that 'women are equal to men' and 'women can do anything a man can do'. So, prove it then. Also, y'all need to stop demanding respect. Respect is earned, not given.

 

Their boss told them. So, potentially, it could have been a lie. But I doubt it.

However, at her new job, she has access to everybody's salary (which is ridiculous, because she isn't THAT senior). She gets paid not only more than every other accountant (except her boss - and they are all men), she gets paid more than everyone else who is not a manager.

If you are good at your job, you will get paid well. I understand there are exceptions to this rule (I have been there myself, and last time I checked I was not a woman), but if not at your current employer, at another employer you will get paid a fair wage for your skillet.