VIC Property manager wants to authorise ex tenants to put the fire alarm back

Discussion in 'Property Management' started by Kate, 23rd Aug, 2019.

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  1. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    Hi all

    Previous tenants left our property in Melbourne and removed the fire alarm while they were living there. They forgot to put the fire alarm back (they should have never removed it in first place).

    Property managers wanted to call an electrician and charge us the owner to put it back. We sent the property manager this link: Smoke alarms and fire safety - advice for tenants and residents


    Tenants or residents should:

    • not deactivate a smoke alarm or interfere with its operation in any way
    • notify the landlord or owner if a smoke alarm is faulty or not in working order.
    When you move out, you should leave the premises, including smoke alarm batteries, in a similar state to when you moved in.

    She suggested the previous tenant to enter in our property (with permission of the new tenant) to put it back the alarm. I think this is unacceptable and a horrible shortcut.
    We want a professional to put it back and fee paid by ex tenants. Ex tenants of course don't want to pay for it and it seems we are going towards a dispute, since the bond will be held.

    I think she is having 2 standards here - if it our responsibility we have to pay a professional, if it is the tenant, she is happy with him going back to the property (what is an absurd) while the new tenant is there.
    Apart from getting a new property manager, what is the best thing to do?


    Thank you,
     
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  2. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    Is it a hard-wired smoke alarm or gas? This needs to be done by an electrician.

    As the tenant has left the property, it should be your trade to install to ensure that it has been put in correctly and the cost deducted from the bond.
     
  3. Mel Morgan

    Mel Morgan Sydney Property Manager Business Member

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    The subscription service I use charge $99 (should be many similar companies in VIC) and they will replace/install etc the smoke detector as well as provide a compliance certificate for the work (and continue for next 12 months). Maybe ask the old tenants to split the cost of this with you?
     
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  4. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    Spot on,
    lucky you still have the bond, you have the power!
     
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  5. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    Get the smoke alarm installed by a professional (your property manager should have the details needed). If the tenant won't pay, take it from their bond.
     
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  6. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    I believe smoke alarm are those battery operated ones,
    similar to https://files.kidde.com/home-safety/en/us/contentimages/440375_i9060.jpg

    I just realised if we allow the ex tenant to put it back, it might invalidate our insurance clause.

    Thank you all , and @Mel Morgan for the fire subscription service. I will talk to the property manager.

    @Peter_Tersteeg the property manager said the tenant doesn't agree and the pm mentioned she would have to make an application to VCAT. How absurd is her attitude?
     
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  7. Michael Mitchell

    Michael Mitchell Well-Known Member

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    Ship has sailed re: the ex-tenants to rectify any issued that were picked up during the exit inspection. Use a professional so you get a tax invoice and can justify claiming it from the bond, no brainer and hopefully they learn not to do it again.
     
  8. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    Tough. The PM is working for you, takes direction from you & should be looking after your interests.

    Is it time to consider a new PM if this one has no backbone?
     
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  9. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    I think your PM is right. If the tenant doesn't agree, you'll need to apply to VCAT to take some of the bond.

    Given that consumer affairs appears to be in your side in this matter, one would hope that you'd win at VCAT if it goes that far. I can't say myself, I don't have much experience in this myself.

    I suspect the mere threat of going to VCAT might get the other party to simply agree to pay for it, or to agree to give up some of the bond without actually going to VCAT. It's probably a matter of your PM bluffing the tenant.
     
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  10. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    Thank you @Peter_Tersteeg - I believe I might have to pay for the time the property manager will spend if VCAT is the solution? I am really disappointed with her at this stage because initially she said it was my responsibility as landlord - only after we sent her the tenants obligations via e-mail that she realised the tenant was wrong in removing the fire alarm.
    Would you have any property manager to recommend? :D
     
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  11. Lil Skater

    Lil Skater Well-Known Member

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    It's true if the tenant doesn't agree to the deduction you would need to go to VCAT, the application cost for bond claims is free - but your PM may charge a fee which would far exceed the cost to reinstate the alarm.

    The PM should've noticed it at the final and given the tenant the opportunity to rectify prior to a new tenant coming in, without a smoke alarm you are presently in breach and your insurance stuffed - I'd get the alarm up immediately and then worry about negotiating the costs with the old tenant. The PM has 10 business days to release the bond, if I were a tenant and had a choice of losing $100 to get $3,000 back now instead of waiting > month I probably would agree.
     
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  12. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    I know a few great PMs. Were is the property?
     
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  13. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    Brunswick, Inner North in Melbourne
     
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  14. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    @Kate I'm not sure if Sam covers Brunswick, but she is a bit of a bad-ass. :D You need a PM that will bluff the tenant, it's not worth going to VCAT over this.

    I have a property in Brunswick myself. We use Jells Craig on Sydney Road. They've generally been quite good, but the PM has recently changed so I'm still evaluating the new one.
     
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  15. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    Thank you @Lil Skater for the heads up that now I am not in breach. I honestly think the property manager is clueless and doesn't understand that we need a professional to fit it. As she wrote it to us: If I had a ladder I would put it back myself ?

    I also believe she thinks (or thought) we were being difficult and might have given the impression to the tenant he could do himself, and now the tenant thinks he has the rights to say no...
     
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  16. Kate

    Kate Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Peter. Let me get in touch with Jells Craig.
     
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  17. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    Talk to Sam (@Lil Skater). If she covers Brunswick, she'd probably be better.

    I've used my current agency for years, they've changed managers quite a bit. They're good, but I do know better. The current tenants have been in there for years and I haven't had a reason to change PMs. Essentially the problem you've described in your other thread.

    If I were looking for a new PM I'd go for a smaller specialist boutique agency rather than one that changes staff every year or two. I prefer to go with the small independent agency that's a specialist where you know the person in charge and they have a few very competent staff.

    The reason I haven't changed agencies is I haven't had a reason to change. I've got long term great tenants and I don't want to throw them into turmoil. I probably will change PMs when the tenants move on.
     
    Last edited: 23rd Aug, 2019
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  18. wylie

    wylie Moderator Staff Member

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    If the PM will charge for attending VCAT, then I'd think it would certainly be cheaper to just pay for the new alarm, and ditch this agent.
     
  19. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    First, check your management agreement to see what VCAT costs are, some charge a flat fee, some charge per hour, some charge per hour with a minium,

    if they charge for any of this it wont be worth it financially to you (yes it sux)

    This should have been picked up on the exit inspection, either it has and you are still chasing it, or it wasnt, and the PM is trying to cover his/her ass.

    A good PM would be first bluffing them by saying its coming out of your bond, and not mentioning VCAT, if the tenant says "Take me to vcat" if the PM is not getting a fee for it, it would be in their best interests to pressure them in to paying.

    If theyre not doing the above, as everyone has said, time to get a new PM
     
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  20. wylie

    wylie Moderator Staff Member

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    Also... before moving to a better PM, I'd put a bit of pressure on this PM to pay for the new one, something they didn't pick up at the end of the lease.

    Then find a better PM.
     
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