Peter Thornhill 2019

Oh dear. I’m a bit annoyed at the moment and trying to stay off the forum at least for a short while. But felt a need to put others out of their misery in relation to why PT doesn’t post here before conspiracy theories get out of control.

Rather than post here PT agreed to participate on a Facebook site created by a PC member specifically related to his method of investing and named it accordingly.

I was also on there for awhile. However Peter became concerned when time and time again members would head down the path of “speculative” investing / trading. He didn’t want others searching the net using his name then finding a Facebook page dedicated to his approach but then think speculation was part of his approach.

I could understand his concerns having seen the conversation direction myself at times. I also ceased participating there.

Even if PT was still interested in posting here (extremely unlikely) I wouldn’t encourage him. There would be those genuinely wanting to debate his approach / beliefs but others would just see it as an opportunity to attack him purely based on tall poppy syndrome etc.

I’ve known PT for many years and communicated with him a number of times. His main objective is simply to try to remove everyday investors fear of the sharemarket. In particular the scary capital volatility that is witnessed every day in the media. It’s a massive revelation to many when they understand the two dimensional nature of shares ie capital vs income.

PT generally avoided mentioning what to invest in suggesting others seek advice. But he was constantly badgered about what he personally invested in. What he personally invests in and stuff like LICs vs ETFs is just a sideshow to the main message.

I questioned him once why he suggested WHF when often asked for at least one thing to get started investing in. He stated that he just wanted others to get started in the sharemarket with a share that was rarely in the news. If he suggested CBA / AFI / ARG for example that are constantly in the media then investors would be getting bogged down following it in the media including good and BAD news. By investing in a low profile LIC like WHF it gave the investor a lower stress way to put their toe in the water so to speak. That was a first step in helping to remove the element of fear about the sharemarket. Hopefully confidence could continue to grow from there.

I could continue on but hopefully that provides enough to get the message.

 

I was also going to mention the FB page but wasn't sure of the reasons he left..

Hopefully you are not annoyed because of the discussion on the forums..

 

I was introduced to PT's style of investing through this forum & for me it's been the best thing ever!! Not worrying about share price gains or losses,just watching the div's roll in & knowing this will be a constant through retirement plus is an easy path to follow & manage for other family members when/if I cannot.

 

I just get the feeling he's a typical "old geezer" who doesn't fully get on board with the internet.
In a recent interview with AusFirebug he admitted he didn't even know what the term FiRe meant, yet he's a god amongst that community.

 

I wouldn’t bother researching FIRE either if I was in my 70s with $400k of dividend income. Clearly he has better things to do

Most people on the street over 40 probably haven’t heard of it either.

 

But the Dividends are bugger all. Earning 4% on money invested 4 years ago and not getting capital growth is going backwards. Investing in set and forget doesn't have to give poor returns. Why doesn't PT advocate investing in something like RFF where you get indexed rising dividends, 10% on money invested 4 years ago instead of a paltry 4%, and get a 15%pa CG you could sell 10% a year still have 5% growth pa, and effectively have a 20% annual return or 4 or 5 times PT's LIC return, if you don't care for capital growth. Each quarter your income would be as much as it is per annum with PT's method. Perhaps throw in 2 ETFs of the top my head NDQ and IXI (consumer staples) buy and forget, and takes about 2 minutes of your life to think about and execute.

 

I hear you, but not worried about CGT as don't intend to sell. As far as capital growth goes, buying the banks & telstra four years ago would see you with a capital loss but yes, with a higher div. Reasons for buying Lic's is as has been explained around here many times,index-like,managed fund type but without the very high fees and the older ones have been around forever & are likely still to be so. There is increased div's,okay they're not shooting the lights out but they are there. Hey I have no problem with people seeking better returns if you have the skill,time & patience none of which I have,I still own a few where I was chasing this but with no great success other than high div's, these will go over time. I just love that when I go away for a while I'm not worried about my 'positions'. Some I hear stressing that they forgot to close their trade on XXX stock before they left & sweating that something doesn't go wrong before they can 'fix' this, meh. But hey good luck to those that like this as there are many, just not for me .

 

It’s a fair point. LICs and indexing makes zero sense if you can pick stocks that’ll deliver 20% per annum for the foreseeable future.

Come on guys we need to lift our game!

 

Yep, I’ve seen the light. bitcoin or bust.

 

Good point Snowball,guess we'll be reading a blog from you about this in the near future .

 

You haved MISSED THE POINTt the companies I mentioned RFF NDQ IXI as they are set and forget buy and never look at again., perhaps once every 10 or 15 years, They need less monitoring than the poorly performing LIC's touted, IXI will perform just as poorly giving neither growth or high yield but it is probably even safer than the LIC's. Not exposed to a single economy, currency, or fruit loop leader, and has wide moat. I suggested it for low risk diversification. RFF you can just collect the dividends which grow without doing a damned thing and you have a large pot of capital to splurge if you want. NDQ is to give balance and exposure to the greatest companies in safe hands, ran by the smartest people in the world . If you want growing income.That is just the way I would skin the set and forget low risk dividend portfolio. The reporting season as shown a few companies with growing dividends that I think would be better than the LIC's, I haven't looked far into it but there would be a little more risk. AX1 is one I bought and looks good for growing income. The growth play is becoming sparse with current share values, but there appears to be some offerings of dividend plays with great potential and growing returns I may nibble at.

 

That's all fine, to each his own, but different views & ideas make it all interesting.

 

You don't have to accept low returns for set and forget.. Lakehouse Capitals managed fund is set and forget, run by Joe Magyer. If you want set and forget check it out. I suggested to Frank he invest there perhaps about a 18 months ago. His Australian and NZ small cap fund has returned 58% in the 2 years since it opened.. His Global Growth fund has returned 20% since it opened a year ago. It is very possible to get 20% plus returns from set and forget He knows what he is doing and seems like a very decent humble person, he made similar outstanding returns when he was managing funds in the USA before moving to Sydney. If you want hands off. Just give your money to him and don't waste you time and money with PT If you want to spent time on investment philosophy I think your time would be better spent listening to Joe.

 

What’s his return over 25 years? This is what I consider short term.

...the questions rhetorical, I have a good idea of the answer.

 

When you have consistently earned 40%p/a for 10 years it doesn't matter. It just becames a bunch of numbers. He is not motivated purely by money or he would have stayed in the USA. He is just following his passion. He has a passion for numbers, investing and the stockmarket which got when a teenager.

 

PT makes a lot of sense to me. Read a lot about finance, knew the sharemarket was the way to go. He help clear up a few ideas i had and set me on a path that sat well with me.

The main point is, we are all at different stages of life, have different ideas, beliefs and risks. Use the parts of PT's ideas/beliefs that resonates with you and continue on your path.

I don't think any one investment theory/idea will fit all. We are all individuals.

 

The bloody hide of it, can you believe MLT emailed me another link to a stupid Dividend Statement today.
Now I have to click on link, type in my post code, type in the stupid “I’m not a robot” text, download and save to the 18-19 folder.
Hardly seems worth it..............and to think they have been annoying stupid investors since 1958 with this type of inconvenience.

 

ummm...some nice suggestions there on some different speculation vehicles! Thats the ponit that PT is trying to get at, buy and hope price goes up to flick to some greater fool is speculation...allocating capital to receive income is investing in his eyes.

Perhaps we should all contemplate a diversified approach like you are suggesting, however, to be frank, the stability & growth of the dividends is what interests me, NOT the chance of capital appreciation. Prior to arcing up in your response bear in mind - you are getting the opinion of a late 40s divorcee, raising two kids and unlikely to ever be able to afford a house in Sydney...PTs approach suits me nicely.

 

Yeah me to. Had a gutful of it. This must stop. And to make it worse they keep sending me more money than I know what to do with. Further decisions to be made. At this stage of my life I shouldn’t have to deal with so much stress. Oh woe is me.

 

Not sure how true this is, but I remember reading somewhere, might have been Barefoot Investor that 60 to 70% of share market returns are from dividends? I can only imagine that is from an Aussie perspective.