NSW Laws Just Announced - Airbnb killer in Sydney

The Sydney tourism dollar is very lucrative. I am sure the Hotels association has been lobbying very hard on this one. If short stay options in Sydney continue to grow at current rates, surely it is taking a hit to the bottom line of all these established hotels.

For the hands on operator it will just encourage more cash / gumtree type arrangements which has worked a treat in places like Bondi well before these new platforms.

It can be a grey area. Places like Bondi have transient flat mate situations so you can't keep banning every style of accommodation.

As long as there is demand and your price point is competitive people will continue to find away to continue to do what they do for higher returns.

 

@thatbum , no not at all. However I have had many years experience dealing with owners, Committees, OCs, Strata Managers, and some of the sharper strata lawyers, in NSW strata.

I find it incredible that the NSW Govt would allow Short Term (let's call it what it is, Holiday) Letting businesses (and, specifically, by offsite lot owners) to be allowed in strata managed buildings, that are occupied by owners and/or long term (min 6 months) residents.

Especially when all stakeholders know full well that Strata Committee members are all volunteers, not professionals, lawyers or police (in the majority of cases).

So why would anybody in their right mind think that it was OK that the Sharing Economy be gifted an opportunity to exploit such residents by sharing all of the downside, but none of the upside?

Whilst the publicity has been mostly about how proponents STLs had "won" and dissenters had "lost", (blatant breaches of the SSMA 2015 aside) lost in all the noise has been a special sting in the tail ie. Airbnb Tax Rules: Airbnb hosts, make sure you know these tax tips...

 

Well I don't really find it incredible at all. If you know something about planning laws and considerations, then you would know that a part-time or incidental short stay use is quite a different prospect compared to a large commercial operation.

 

Fair enough, but not quite, as a number of NSW local govt LEPs require a council DA for a short term change to residential use.

 

Yes that's the same as nearly everywhere - short stay is a different use compared to normal residential.

But I guess that's where NSW decided to draw the line - 180 days would be half residential/half short stay at the maximum, and stratas still retain the ability to ban them.

 

Playing devils advocate might infer that they were attempting to make it less attractive by cutting the yield in half...

 

Yes, because long term neighbours from hell don't exist What's that, they make up a very small percentage? Well so do STR/STL. I'm sure for as many Airbnb issues that made it to the news, I can find the same for long term tenants.

Aren't long term landlords off-site profit seekers too? Who on earth rent out their place if they don't expect some sort of profit unless they're a charity. Not sure why you're on this forum if "off-site profit seekers" irks you so much.

Most guests are very understanding of the medium to long term expectations of residences, especially if you educate them or include key points from the strata rules in your house rules.

There are many ways to get around this regardless of whether you rent the whole place or part of it.

Some things may have to be tested in court... I may be happy to be a martyr for this cause.

 

But @Pentanol , if you had an understanding of your standard by-laws, you would be well aware that there is a mechanism to deal with "long term neighbours from hell", as you describe them, as opposed to the holiday lettings (STL/STRs) tenants, where there is none.

And your interpretation of profit seekers might be a little different to mine, as "long term landlords", to use your words, would probably find your aspersion as a little obtuse, and you don't need to be concerned as to my reasons for being on this forum, except that a number of Strata Committees and OCs will find themselves less intimidated from STL advocates such as yourself with arguments that seem to offer nothing more than "..there's nothing you can do".

"Most guests" ... understanding... the expectations of residences are irrelevant. Why don't you offer an argument to your fellow onsite neighbours, of which you don't seem to be one, as to why they need to put up with the recurring issues of the guests who misunderstand those same expectations of residences?

And, whilst you propose that there are many ways to "get around this" (and I am referring specifically to offsite owners STLs), and your happiness "...to be a martyr for this cause", let me assure you, assuming that you are currently an owner participating in what is clearly a commercial letting business within NSW strata, that there is a also risk of having access to your lot disabled, only on the off chance your Strata Committee decides to grow a backbone.

And then you can go through the long and expensive process to obtain an order to bring things back to the status quo.

 

So can you explain to me why you keep calling a short term letting arrangement a "commercial letting business" and not apply the same to a longer term residential lease?

Because they appear to have the same level of 'commercialism' to me. Money being exchanged for somewhere to stay...

 

Exactly this. I have posted it multiple times before but long term neighbours from hell (including owners) do in fact exist and although there might be ways to deal with renters it's very difficult and time consuming- and is there even an option for owners?

We have hosted close to 200 sets of guests across 3 properties with very few issues that would impact neighbours- in fact we've had the opposite with one family who stayed with us through airbnb complaining about some of the (long term renter) neighbours partying too much and keeping them awake. We did have one incident with a set of guests but they moved out the next day- problem is gone.

And there actually is a very easy way of dealing with holiday letting tenants if they are troublesome either by either a) prematurely ending their stay (which is extremely easy to do if they break any of your house rules) or b) wait til their 2-3 day stay ends...

 

Then there are the Airbnb listings that specifically tell you not to tell anyone you are paying to stay, just say you are friends of the owner. (Some vancouver listings 2017).

Not the sort of education I am willing to accept.
Marg

 

I looked at Sydney Airbnb and Homestay (Stayz) data and its all public.
I can see how many nights per property, how long and a range of stats. And how many properties each operator has...and property details (limited). The NSW Govt wants access to platforms for this data on top.

 

I think that's the point. It goes two ways and the short term guest (not a tenant as defined by one who has signed the proscribed lease) can cause trouble and just leave. There is no skin in the game.

 

There actually is- you can set a bond (which they would lose) and the review system will clean out most of the bad ones- I wouldn't accept a booking from someone with bad reviews.

By comparison, we had some terrible tenants at one of our other properties (traditional rental)- we had lots of issues with them including complaints from neighbors, keeping pets, not paying rent timely etc. Eventually we got rid of them (it was hard) and our PM gave them a terrible review for their next application- but they got accepted anyway. There are bad eggs in owners, renters and short term stays- those that are short term are just MUCH easier to get rid of quickly.

 

Do you set bonds?

And how does a bond help when breach they breach bylaws?

 

I don't personally as we haven't had any issues- if we were to start having issues, I would set a bond.

What sort of bylaws are you talking about them breaching? How would a bond for a short term rental vary from a bond for a traditional rental? Owners also don't pay bonds.

 

So there is no "skin in the game" except for a bad review... That is very different to a bond, obligations of a residential tenancy agreement, tenant desire for tenure, occupant contact details notified to the owners corportation. All of which drive good behaviour. This is the downside to the owners corportation that the owner is signing it up for.

It is all a bit moot now as the owners corporation can make a decision on whether it is permitted.

 

Sorry, @thatbum, I should have been more specific and called it a short term commercial letting business.

The recourse of the Strata Committees (in NSW) is different is dealing with the former and the latter, should it be necessary.

The obfuscation of STL proponents of "sharing" and "short term commercial letting" seems to provide only ambiguity.

eg. Airbnb regulation needs to distinguish between sharing and plain old commercial letting

 

@jodes, are your 3 properties within a strata community?

And, if so, and assuming you are an offsite owner (given you cant be in 3 places at once), how did your OC secretary and Committee address the by-law breaches from your lot(s)?

 

Just thought I'd bump this thread up. Has anybody heard anything recently?