NSW fires

Discussion in 'Property Market Economics' started by Kangabanga, 11th Nov, 2019.

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  1. Thedoc

    Thedoc Well-Known Member

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    Let’s stick to facts.

    - national parks and wildlife have hit their hazard reduction targets over the past 5 years

    - hazard reduction burns don’t stop ‘catastrophic’ rated fires

    - it is becoming harder to conduct hazard reductions as it’s a specific set of parameters that need to be met. Too hot or too windy no burn.

    - a hazard reduction is not a back burn

    - it is the state government that funds fire and rescue nsw and the RFS

    - the state government has cut fire and rescues capital expenditure budget from $80 million down to $50 this year. This is things like trucks, firefighting equipment etc.

    - there are hundreds of off duty fire and rescue Professional firefighters that could be utilised between their normal rostered shifts if there were more spare trucks available to be manned. There is currently approximately 20. Joke.

    - we need a single fire service. At the moment it is a contest between the services. The RFS hates asking Fire and Rescue for assistance because bushfires are its time to gain media and public attention.

    - besides the RFS back burn that went wrong and was reported in the media (20 homes lost) there have been multiple others that have caused homes to burn. You can’t lights a back burn on a catastrophic day and expect it to end well. There tactics are outdated.

    - Criticism of the heirachy of the RFS (not the firefighters on the ground) is incredibly difficult as they are seen as volunteers and you can’t criticise volunteers regardless of poor outcomes.

    Fact is these fires could’ve been dealt with way more effectively. More firefighters on the ground USING WATER and less backburning and we could be living in clean air right now.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 7th Jan, 2020
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  2. balwoges

    balwoges Well-Known Member

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    Therein lies the fault in your argument ... what water in this drought stricken country which is regularly short of water?
     
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  3. Rugz06

    Rugz06 Well-Known Member

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    You forgot to add a few critical ones
    - whilst capital expenditure is down the increase in rfs operational expenditure and other areas have increased to record levels. 2.7% higher than last year.

    - there are approximately 900 workers of the RFS that are paid employees.


     
  4. mues

    mues Well-Known Member

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    You know that 90% of what you wrote is opinion not facts, right?
     
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  5. Paul@PAS

    Paul@PAS Tax, Accounting + SMSF + All things Property Tax Business Plus Member

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    92.7% of statistics are made up
     
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  6. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    Perhaps you can break down what you see as opinion only?
     
  7. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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  8. George Smiley

    George Smiley Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: 7th Jan, 2020
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  9. marmot

    marmot Well-Known Member

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    A lot of people have notoriously short memories.
    Give it a couple of quiet years on the fire front and many people will be back on important stuff like the price of power.
     
  10. significance

    significance Well-Known Member

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    Here are a few ways in which I would expect this to affect the economy generally, and property prices in particular:
    • Insurance costs will increase. While the impact of this on property prices is not direct, at some point it will have an impact on bank lending calculations.
    • The building and related service industries (about 7% of NSW economy) will do very well in the immediate aftermath of the fire (just as we have seen in Townsville after the 2019 flood). This will provide a short-term cash-flow boost the the local economy.
    • Countering this, we will see a drop in economic activity in the education sector (5% of the economy) as international students turn elsewhere and the tourism industry (~7%). This will have flow-on effects for the rental market, particularly short-term rentals and rentals near universities.
    • We'll also see a drop in agricultural production for the year (~2% of NSW economy) due to fire, smoke, heat and general disruptions. This will also increase groceries costs, leaving less month-to-month cash in the pockets of buyers.
    Property markets in Brisbane and Townsville have proven remarkably resilient to disasters such as floods, with prices in affected areas bouncing back in less than a year in spite of the ongoing risks. However, as we see these events happening more and more frequently in future, people will surely begin to take notice of disaster risks in making their housing decisions.
     
    Last edited: 7th Jan, 2020
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  11. Angel

    Angel Well-Known Member

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    From our experience in Qld after the 2011 floods, insurance premiums skyrocketed for every customer, not just those individually affected by the floods or cyclones. Not surprisingly, these companies were not keen to lower their premiums again in subsequent years.
     
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  12. SatayKing

    SatayKing Well-Known Member

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    I wonder at the number who are under insured. When they find out it's going to add to the misery. Poor buggers in both senses of the word.
     
  13. albanga

    albanga Well-Known Member

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    It’s actually 94.67%
     
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  14. significance

    significance Well-Known Member

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    There's a good article on this at A crisis of underinsurance threatens to scar rural Australia permanently

    According to the article, part of the problem is that most people insure their property at its market value, but costs to rebuild are typically at least 20% higher.
     
  15. Thedoc

    Thedoc Well-Known Member

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    Correct we are in drought. Despite this the mosts sever fires of the past 2 months have had water readily available. Fact is:

    - fires in the blue mountains = water available in water mains in street. Firies can tap into this

    - fires around batemans bay/Ulladulla/barley point = see above

    - fires on central coast = no readily available water mains. This is why brigades have bulk water tankers

    The drought has nothing to do with water both the RFS and Fire and Rescue NSW have access to to fight the fires that have been receiving all the coverage on the news.
     
  16. Thedoc

    Thedoc Well-Known Member

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    Oh dear. Once again people demonstrating that they don’t understand their are 2 fire services in NSW. If you read my post you will see I was talking about Fire and Rescue NSW budget. Who said anything about the RFS? Do I need to post the table from the nsw treasury report written by non other than Josh Frydenburg to price my point?
     
  17. Thedoc

    Thedoc Well-Known Member

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    I would also be interested to know what is my opinion and not fact?
     
  18. TAJ

    TAJ Well-Known Member

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    Try telling that to families that have lost loved ones, properties or businesses.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 7th Jan, 2020
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  19. Kelvin Cunnington

    Kelvin Cunnington Well-Known Member

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    The previous fires of Ash Wednesday and Black Saturday have had no impact on immigration that anyone could note.
     
  20. Kelvin Cunnington

    Kelvin Cunnington Well-Known Member

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