Nathan Birch "dumping" properties according to Macrobusiness

Discussion in 'Property Experts' started by emza, 23rd Jun, 2017.

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  1. sash

    sash Well-Known Member

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    ya going to get strung up by the reds on this site....
     
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  2. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    The article you linked to directly and explicitly contradicts your point.
     
  3. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member

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    Lol, did I mention RAMS low doc, very good product;):p
     
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  4. sash

    sash Well-Known Member

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    yep
     
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  5. Hwangers

    Hwangers Well-Known Member

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    well this thread escalated quickly...
     
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  6. Skilled_Migrant

    Skilled_Migrant Well-Known Member

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    Nope.
     
  7. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    Really? This is what you said, direct quote:

    This is what the article says, direct quote:

    "Under the policy, investors would only be able to claim a tax deduction against losses, or the cost of borrowing, to offset their investment income."

    It's pretty clear from this statement that investors will be able to claim a deduction for borrowing costs against investment income whereas you claim "the borrowing costs were only allowed to be offset against the capital gain not against the income".
     
  8. Skilled_Migrant

    Skilled_Migrant Well-Known Member

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    Complete paragraph in the article is
    "Under the policy, investors would only be able to claim a tax deduction against losses, or the cost of borrowing, to offset their investment income. The existing arrangement allows them to offset their losses against other sources of income, which acts as an incentive to borrow to invest in shares."

    Spot the difference.

    Over riding verbatim statement from the shadow assistant treasurer Andrew Leigh "Negatively geared shares purchased after 1 July 2017 will no longer be able to be used to reduce wage and salary income" He said losses could be used to reduce future capital gains tax and changes would not apply retrospectively.

    Only definitive deductions are:
    • Wage/salary cannot be used for NG.
    • Losses can be offset against CGT.
    The shadow assistant treasurer did not rule the other (than wage) income in/out.

    But a good straw man. We have stopped discussing the property NG and are busy splitting hair on pedantic issue which did not materialize in the last election.
     
  9. kierank

    kierank Well-Known Member

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    Why am I not surprised!!!
     
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  10. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    I do. Do you? This is exactly as I stated.
     
  11. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    It's a free kick for people who have investment income (e.g. dividends) and investment losses (i.e. from a rental property). They will continue to be able to effectively negatively gear and speculate on property as before. For them, nothing will change. Now, do you suppose it will be higher income earners or lower income earners in this category?
     
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  12. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    In any case, I have a problem with Labors policy as I stated before.

     
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  13. Skilled_Migrant

    Skilled_Migrant Well-Known Member

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    So you have effectively overlooked (a) Other points regarding NG of property (b) the statement by the shadow assistant treasurer, which was the basis of the article

    Now that we are nit picking straw man's hair style i.e. the proposed NG policy which did not materialize, how does the proposal compare with the current state of NG :
    • Is there a confinement of income losses to the investment or not which was not there earlier? Can losses from shares be offset against property and vice-versa?
    • Does it impose a virtual cap on the amount of loses or not by virtue of earnings and gains in that stream ? Assuming investor borrowed X amount for shares in a company which goes insolvent, can the losses (borrowings, cost of borrowing and equity) be offset against property or salary income or property CG ?
    • Does the proposal quarantine salary / wages from speculative investments or not ?
    The free kick is being reined in for speculation, unlike what you are saying. The rules confine the high earners as compared to now, that's why the squealing and obfuscation.
     
  14. kierank

    kierank Well-Known Member

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    You are NOT alone.
     
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  15. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    I wasn't trying to discuss the article or comments by the shadow assistant treasurer. I was trying to discuss Labors proposal and problems I have with it. Nice straw man though.

    I have an opinion about Labors Negative Gearing policy and I am entitled to express my opinion without getting attacked.

    Are you not concerned that, under Labors policy, investors will still be able to offset investment losses against other investment income?
     
  16. Skilled_Migrant

    Skilled_Migrant Well-Known Member

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    Personal attack is something that happened to Emza today / yesterday-- textbook bullying not by 1 person but by a group of adults, but not a complain or a whisper from Emza...speaks volumes about the strength of character of the person.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: 28th Jun, 2017
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  17. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    Yeah, nah. Lots of posts by lots of people, including emza were deleted. There was plenty of personal attacks to go around. Your post isn't helping (and now most of it has been edited out).

    All these posts which call "STRAW MAN" or "AD HOMINEM" (which all parties seem to enjoy yelling at each other) aren't exactly helpful.
     
  18. Simon Hampel

    Simon Hampel Founder Staff Member

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    Okay - let's get back on the topic of Nathan Birch please.
     
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  19. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member

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    So what is Nathan up to these days? I am not one of his disciples, but always curious, I mean the guy made a killing in real estate, it can not be ignored, clearly doing something right.

    Last I read was he purchased land in outer burbs Syd and selling to clients??
     
  20. melbournian

    melbournian Well-Known Member

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    @MTR I am wondering if he sold that many properties (wouldn't the portfolio be smaller ) as tax would be payable hence reducing the gains made . not sure if they're bought in his single name or through trust etc