Nathan Birch defaulting on IP mortgages...

Debt after unloading 20properties: 18m

Nathan Birch blames the overdue mortgage on having to administer 200 properties

Claimed net worth: 55m

$55m property mogul Nathan Birch’s surprising admission

Portfolio LVR (after selling said properties?): 24%

Something doesn't add up.

 

His numbers never add up... that means he's either got less then he says or he earns more than he says... but he certainly doesn't instill confidence when he opens his mouth... my sixth sense has always found something "suss" about him... but thats my opinion and no one need share it.

Why is it that whenever he does a PR campaign ( and lets face it - the Sunday show was a PR campaign...the journalism was pathetic - zero scrutiny or verification whatsoever) the "testimonials" rolled out are either staff or wide eyed children/barely adults?

Take poor old Rochelle. Earns 63K , has spent everything she's got on an old house, and believes she can build a duplex and turn a 500K profit. Please. Even if she could generate that kind of profit ( and she cant) where's she going to get the money from to build? She will need 550-600K to build. Its way outside her borrowing capacity.

And just quietly, never mind that she was paying $2.50 for a 250g bag of instant brown rice when she was supposedly a super scrooge with groceries... First thing my wife noticed... and she has zero interest in money or property ...but she knew that was BS.

Poor old Ozkan.. earns 50K and has 250K down on a non income producing block of dirt...thats all well and good but he hasn't started building yet... where's he going to get the borrowing capacity from? Journalist didnt even ask... Pleeeeease. And even if he does manage somehow ( I dont see how on 50K with 250K owing ) hows he going to service it during the build and then hold it on a 50K income? Pleeeeease. Somebody... the maths are sooooo far out.

Will we ever have a mature, professional person who isn't either a kid or doesn't work for him... go on screen and PROVE that they've made themselves better off following him?

I sat there last night thinking...is this journalist going to even attempt to question these numbers? Ask for evidence of anything? What about the debt position? what about holding costs? What about sourcing a few dozen of his Binvested clients and seeing how they are placed 5 years or 10 years after buying ? There was zero journalism ...just a love in. Am I missing something?

 

You maybe underestimating the money he makes from his businesses. I would imagine he would be making quite a substantial income from the buyers agency and other services he offers his clients. If he is parking that money in his portfolio that could be paying down the debt fast and reducing his LVR.

I have said it before he has courage and he dreams big. I don't know too many 32 year olds that have created such an empire. He gets a lot of criticism on this forum and the reality is most of us have not achieved a fraction of what he has built for himself.

He is obviously a mentor to his clients, they want to be like him and achieve a fraction of what he has achieved that's what he sells. The young people interviewed are obviously making some big sacrifices to buy property. It may be a little extreme but I don't think its a bad thing for these young folk to strive towards building something for their futures.

Talk about turning negative press (the loan default or should we say late payment) into something positive for himself with his TV interview. He is great at promoting himself and his business and I think people actually like his casual attire/approach. It makes him somehow more relatable to a lot of people and he is not trying to be someone he is not.

I actually have a lot of respect for him, how could you not admire what he has achieved for himself.

 

No. We want to know how often he smokes his tyres up! Yeeee ha!

 

That was my first thought, too.
Her and Ozkan probably got sold on short term capital gains on the knockdown and block of land to tap into "free" equity of which to get the loan for the builds.

 

I did wonder that, but the website doesn't suggest any plates are not available.

Well ... I wanted to find out if there was any debt on it but I think I would have to do a PPSR search and am not about to fork out my $ for that.

 

equity doesn't equal borrowing capacity though...

Anyway...

 

I wrote previously that I expected he must generate income from those businesses, which makes it all the concerning that he missed payments and failed to settle on property last year - he admitted as much on a Youtube video.. Perhaps those businesses are floundering. The quality of new clients appears quite low if last nights examples are anything to go by...

All I know is, to qualify for $20+ million in debt pre APRA required far less income than is now required to service $20+million in debt as it migrates to P&I... and by now at least some of his debt has to have started migrating. he certainly cant borrow any more or refinance - by his own admission he was unable to secure money to settle on property in 2017...

If his "average" loan was IO for 10 years, his repayments would jump @55-60% upon migration. Using 5% P&I as an example, that's the same as 8% IO. If his properties are worth an average 250K ( 200x 250K = 50 Million) that means his repayments could be as high as 1.6 Million per annum ( 20million x 8%) versus the 1 Million they would have been if the loans stayed IO.

If he had a bunch of his early loans on 10 years IO when he started accumulating at 18,19,20 years of age, those would have rolled out by now. If he had them on 15 years IO they will be due to roll soon...

I dunno... he says he nets 500K after all costs, so thats 2.5K per property ( 200 x 2.5K) so add 50 or 60% to his holding costs - even if its only on 30 or 40% of his loans, and however you cut it he will be CF- on a chunk of his portfolio for the first time in his life. As more loans roll to P&I the CF- position will get far worse...

 

Karina...I don't always agree with @euro73 ....but lately I am agreeing with him...

I too admit he has a lot of gumption and the ability of picking himself up. The issue is not that he is successful...a lot of people don't begrduge you..but how he has gone off the reservation.

As for the amount of money he is making would have been a consideration before ...the banks would have put pressure for him to sell. There are probably other factors in plan..whilst he made alot of money...they are probably seeing that it is unlikely that his CF will be repeated and would be concerned about his quality of assets and the ability to sell in a fire sale.

Nutin' wrong with having a go...but if it is leading Dorothy up the yellow brick road then that becomes an issue.

Euro makes a very good point in that most people on 65k and 50k will not be able to borrow the amounts. I think Ozkan's 250k purchase may get up and he might be able to build something for 240k...but I can't see Rachel being able to pull off the development without additional income ...probably will need to come from the other half. To make a 500k proift assuming they bought the house for say 500k plus 600k for duplex...the end value will need to be 1.6m..so 800k per duplex...that might be a pipe dream...

 

I read somewhere (think it was even in this thread) that all his loans are P&I.

 

Agree with what @euro73 and @sash are saying, good on him for achieving what he's claimed to achieve, it's more a case of believe half of what you see and none of what you hear because as said somethings just not adding up.

Out of curiousity, I've always wondered, to be on the rich list and to be 'known to have X amount' publicly what does one do and what is the scrutineering process?

**
I just want to take this opportunity to let everyone know I've got a net worth of just under $100million, I've got a load of cash in an offset that I'll use to buy a flash car and my number plates [RICH.AS] are n the mail.
If you want to know how to achieve the same, that can be arranged for a fee. Now who wants to be part of my marketing and PR team?
The above is of course all tongue in cheek but it makes me wonder, could it really be that simple to 'fake it till you make it'

 

I should also let everyone on this forum know that I've got a net worth of under $100 million. In fact, it's even under $1 billion!

 

It's the 'as if' doctrine popular amongst self-help gurus. You act 'as if' you are already rich. Through autosuggestion and a change of mindset you believe, the law of attraction kicks in and success becomes yours.

Discussion of the personality vs the character ethic at Doug McCann - Author's Blog (Covey vs Carnegie - Oct 6/15)

 

Know lots of people like that....portray an image of success far beyond what they actually are....fraudsters guv....on me oath...they are guv..know what i mean....

 

I dont know. But at some point they will be

 

so in all seriousness, could almost anyone just claim to have a vast wealth, buy a flash car and off you go?

I repeat, the above was tongue in cheek, I do not have a massive net wealth just in case some of you think I'm being serious lol.

 

I suspect that the net worth of most Rich Listers is exaggerated somewhat. I've seen a few, particularly on the young list, and the claimed valuation of their assets is far in excess of the income generated.

As an example, about twenty five years ago, Terry Pratchett would regularly post to the alt.fan.pratchett Usenet newsgroup.

One year he made his debut on The Times Rich List, whereupon several regulars posted, "Hey Pterry, I didn't know that you were so wealthy."

Turns out that he didn't have that much in the bank (to his disappointment), but rather it was based on a notional value of what the Discworld franchise's rights were worth.

Then you've got people who inflate their net worth as a sales tactic. A lot of rappers are known for doing this.

 

Wow this thread is getting wild..

 

It’s ticking along nicely