My First Development Project - Melbourne

Discussion in 'Development' started by Sheepy, 19th Nov, 2019.

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  1. Sheepy

    Sheepy Member

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    Hey guys, I am looking at purchasing a beach side site of 444msq (37m x 12m) to build two side by side double storey, 3BR+study/2BR dwellings, single Garage. Kingston Council. Aim is to sell and profit. I am in finance so I have spoken too and assisted many builder/developers do well and it's about time I started. I have a builder friend who is likely to do the build and has assisted with ballpark on all potential costs
    Project cost (over-estimate) $2.3m turnkey includes holding costs 15mths. Finance required say $1.8m development finance + $500k investor funds. Potential profit I believe is very realistic and achievable less dreaded Tax (is ATO watching ;))
    Few Q's:

    1. TAX/CGT/Margin Scheme - I know this is individual so seeking general info and ideas:
    - I'm thinking purchase in a Corporate entity with Family Trust to distribute and minimise tax
    - Do we need to hold property for 6-12mths to reduce CGT ? or is this only Owner Occ
    - Is Margin Scheme applicable (I guess as a going concern but does this apply if personal Investment vs business)
    - If we were to put in personal names, is it 6 or 12 months to reduce CGT 50%?

    2. Size appears small however I have seen other similar developments on around 14m wide lot (with a single & double garage). Is this width 12m just too narrow to make it work /sale-able ?

    3. What would be a fair/equitable rule of thumb with Investors ie
    - they are providing capital of $500k so I am thinking of returning % of profit based on % of total development costs eg 22% ( plus their Interest costs (as they are borrowing these funds to invest @ say 4%pa). What is general view ?

    Appreciate any ideas. Thank you !
     
  2. Terry_w

    Terry_w Lawyer, Tax Adviser and Mortgage broker in Sydney Business Member

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    There will be no cgt as on revenue account probably.
    Margin scheme might be worth looking into.
     
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  3. lixas4

    lixas4 Well-Known Member

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    I have been looking into investors for medium sized land subs. And found other developers, syndicates offer different options like the below:

    1. 25% a year as debt, paid at the end
    2. 20% a year as debt, plus a profit split, say 30% of profit split between the pool of investors, 70% for developer.

    We will be using probably the second option above or a variation of it. Investors get 'guaranteed' (paid before developers profit, so gaurenteed as much as it can be) 20% as debt and then the potential upside of development profit (30%).

    Im a big fan of the parkdale/mentone/mordy area, beautiful part of the world. I was even a mentone iceberger for a time, should get back into it.
     
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  4. fizzyclang

    fizzyclang New Member

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    I'm going through the process of establishing an investor syndicate at the moment similar to what you've described above. How were the two options structured in terms of a written contract & or paperwork?
     
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  5. Tufan Chakir

    Tufan Chakir Well-Known Member

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    Get on to a designer-Architect - Town Planner ASAP about this
    Do not make assumptions
    Just because there are similar projects around don't assume yours will be the same.

    Consider - single garage (allow wall thicknesses, and rough figures) 4m wide (internal 3.5), Double 6m wide - that's 10m out of your 12m width - allow separation wall thickness and you don't have much left for entries - and a long passageway to the rear. Even trimming the numbers down a bit, reduced wall thicknesses by selective materials - the numbers are going to be similar
     
  6. Westminster

    Westminster Tigress at Tiger Developments Business Member

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    There is a massive difference between 12 and 14m wide unfortunately, with 7m of width you can have a single garage + hallway + a small room at the front but with 6m wide you are a lot more constrained and you basically will just fit a single garage plus hallway plus staircase and end up with longer corridors.
    A good designer might be able to get around it but it's going to have quite a few compromises to make it work.
     
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  7. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    what on earth is a mentone iceberger????

    given the area, I can only think of drug conntations
     
  8. Rooky

    Rooky Well-Known Member

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    Hi Sheepy,

    It has to be margin scheme GST which will appx 2-3% end value. This is not exact figure but approximate. If i were you, i will take off/allow 5% of end value to account for margin scheme GST and selling costs.

    For rest, i think comments by @Westminster and others are sopt on.

    Good luck with your project.
     
  9. lixas4

    lixas4 Well-Known Member

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    Haha, swimming at mentone beach, there is about 50 regulars. To be an 'iceberger' you have to swim at least a couple times a week for the full year, wearing trunks or budgies only. I did the full year a couple of years ago, but got a little lazy of late, which my wife reminds me of every now and then....
     
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  10. Sheepy

    Sheepy Member

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    When you say 25% as debt, is this Interest rate return ?
     
  11. Sheepy

    Sheepy Member

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    Thanks Tufan, meeting with Architect tomorrow. I came across a plan from a company with surprisingly exact land dimensions. It looks all feasible and the Architect sent us a rough sketch. I like the idea of selective materials to reduce walls. Thank you !
     
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  12. Sheepy

    Sheepy Member

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    Thanks Rooky, had intensive meet with an accountant today that specialises in developments and it makes a lot more sense and how we structure. I had an allowance for GST in my Analysis around 2% plus selling costs
     
  13. lixas4

    lixas4 Well-Known Member

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    Yes
     
  14. CTSB

    CTSB Well-Known Member

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    12m is well below the standard block width in the area.

    The bayside standard block is 15.5m wide, volume builders offer this as a completely seperate build type due to the consistent irregular block widths in the bayside area. 15.5m.

    Just a reminder that you can't simply plonk 2 garages and an entry door on each townhouse to make up the width, one of the two dwellings has to have a livable space in the front, usually a home office or such in one of the entry hallways. This is from recently getting a dual occ through Kingston council on a 600m2 15.5m block width.

    This is due to Kingstons requirement of the development having a connection with the front streetscape which they feel is dying out with current development types.


    12m is going to be fairly tight.