Education & Work Managing people in the workplace issue

Discussion in 'Living Room' started by TMNT, 3rd Sep, 2018.

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  1. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    However, you have already stated that she is aware of employment laws, so you will have to tread carefully.

    Presumably, she decided to return to work. That's unfortunate. Perhaps the walking out on the job can be the subject of the first written warning?
     
  2. Sackie

    Sackie Well-Known Member

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    She's poison and needs to be ****** out. Whatever the best process is, (you determine that via laws etc), but I'd get rid of her asap.
     
  3. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for feedback everyone.
    She's improved 100% and I'm pretty happy about the situation however as someone who is quite cynical and doesn't believe that someone can change that much, especially who is probably arrogant enough to behave like that even though being aware,
    I think it's only temporary.
    But I'll be happy until further notice :p
    Or until I go
     
  4. Squirt

    Squirt Active Member

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    If she's casual don't put her on the roster anymore :) She'll quickly realise she needs to find income elsewhere!
     
  5. Tim86

    Tim86 Well-Known Member

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    People like this look at one thing to see if what they are doing is acceptable "I still have the job".

    You can do whatever and say whatever etc... etc... etc... but as long as she still has the job she will think what she is doing is actually not that bad.

    It's the same in an abusive relationship. You can talk to an abuser until you are blue in the face, but if you still allow the relationship they still think what they are doing must not be too bad.

    Fire her. You can't make her grow up.
     
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  6. geoffw

    geoffw Moderator Staff Member

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    I did actually think that the lack of consequences for her walking out on the job was a bit like the victim of an abusive relationship.

    A written warning would act as a signal that what she is doing is not acceptable; it also starts the termination process if bad behaviour occurs again.
     
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  7. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    agree,
    this is my personal amateur mindset in these sort of situations,

    without any punishemnt eg written warning, or firing,
    in essence you are allowing them to get away with it , and the next time the same thing comes up, they will think its ok , since they got away with it last time, (consciously or subconsciously)

    my boss says , you got to handle every person differnlty or else there would be no staff left,

    I am more old school and would rather put them in their place, and tell them/show them that they are replaceable, and one more outburst and they will lose their job,
    at least they know where they stand and if it hurts their feeling, STIFF!

    the only people learn is to feel/experience the consequences of their actions,
    that being said I always give people second chances

    as I said Im not great at managing people, and hence why im probably in this situation
     
  8. Joynz

    Joynz Well-Known Member

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    You’ve mentioned a few times that you don’t think you are a good manager. Above, you mentioned that you prefer to put people in their place...show them they are replaceable etc. In the modern workplace, this approach isn’t considered effective.

    I suggest that you might benefit from professional development in the differing approaches to managing staff inluding conflict resolution, working with a varied a diverse workforce, listening etc. that might give you more confidence and help with more effective work relationships.
     
  9. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    yep, totally agree 100%

    its hard for me, because thats how I was taught, by my strict parents and how I trained,

    I should have been a bit clearer, I probably wouldnt been as blunt and said to the staff "hey, you are replaceable so pull your head in and shut your mouth" but I would be a bit more sublte as geoffw suggestion by means of a written warning which effectively tells them that indirectly,

    i do admire who manage staff superwell, and I often wonder which is more the contributing factor, the staff are great or the manager is awesome

    for example, at my place, we take in turn to clean the toilets, rather than be seen as a bossy troll who just says do this do that because Im too lazy and old, I will always show the staff how to do it and then put myself on the roster first , so that I lead by example, that I do the dirty work as well,

    but ive also been told many times that a good manager delegates
     
    Last edited: 9th Sep, 2018
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  10. Redwing

    Redwing Well-Known Member

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    Fair Work have a great resource of templates to use
     
  11. Angel

    Angel Well-Known Member

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    The manager and staff clean the toilets. What industry is this?

    BTW, good on you for being the leader with this.
     
  12. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    small gym :)

    one of my previous places I worked at the owner who was a clean freak preferred staff to do it, and it worked ,so I implemented it here,
     
  13. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    ok, eveyone, can I grab your feedback, I just remembered an incident a while ago,

    how would you guys have handled it

    we/I order these boxes that we use and I stack them on a shelf
    I stack them very high because we have limited space, and we can go through a lot plus ordering is done weekly
    you need a chair to reach the top of them, nor I or the other staff have problems getting a chair, and reaching the top.

    on this incident, the day before , said employee said how stupid it was that it was stacked so high (mind you they are paper boxes), I ignored her
    the next day she posted in our staff group chat saying "this is not the way to do it, and is stupid" or something along those lines
    the next day, she needed those boxes and tried to life the entire stack (its very light), and they toppled over, she had a rant "see! I told you how stupid it was" and she just left the boxes on the ground

    i know this incident sounds silly and it is, but its about behavior

    WWYD
     
  14. hobartchic

    hobartchic Well-Known Member

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    To be honest, I've been reading through this thread and thinking about it for a while.

    I think it's important to be careful that your bias isn't leading you. In other words, you've decided a member of staff is a problem, now if she does anything, she's the problem. I'm not convinced she is in this instance, or most of them.

    I think it's important to listen to staff. Then, take into account their point of view, and then make decisions when you need to. A good manager knows when to delegate. And, it's not all the time.

    With the paper thing, it was short sighted. It was also potentially incredibly dangerous.

    You're running a business. Give your staff the best training, listen to them a bit more, and find the balance. Just because you're the manager does not mean that you are right about everything. The best people are always looking for the best outcomes for the business and that means having an opinion. Fire the people without the guts to suggest something is stupid (misguided is a more diplomatic way of putting it), they contribute little.
     
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  15. hobartchic

    hobartchic Well-Known Member

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    I'd also suggest going to TAFE and doing some management courses.
     
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  16. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    So, what do you think the problem is. I've had other staff complain about her (however just the odd whinge)
    The boxes Are not dangerous. They're essentially the weight of 1 piece of paper. No one has had a problem with them. The entire stack, the girl can lift the entire stack with two fingers, that's how light they are.

    I don't want or need or appreciate to be questioned about every decision i make

    And yes you are right, being manager doesn't make me right about every decisions. If being a manger meant you had to be perfect, a manager would neevr exist.
    Hence if I get some suggestions from any of the staff, I always listen, which may be my down fall.
    That being said, I've been assigned the role for a reason, all my decisions should be respected

    You also mention bias, in fact until this last incident, the boss wanted to get rid of her, I infact said to him, "look, she's a great worker 98% of the time, if the 2% she's going to be a complete *****, I'm happy to cop it for the 2%, I'm not going to lose sleep over it"
     
  17. Joynz

    Joynz Well-Known Member

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    What are the boxes for? And why stacked as made up boxes rather than flattened?

    There are definitely some OHS issues here. (At the very least, you need a small stepladder rather than a chair to access the stacked boxes if they can’t be reached from the ground and, if possible, to work out a different way to store the boxes.) She might be shorter than the others and it might be difficult for her to reach them.

    How would I have dealt with it? It might be good to get suggestions (including her suggestions) about how to store the boxes. It sounds like she identified a problem and it was ignored.

    Perhaps she also would benefit from a course on communication, but it also sounds like she has a lot of ideas about the business that are coming across (or being interpreted) as criticism when some might be useful.
     
    Last edited: 11th Sep, 2018
  18. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    Boxes come flat packed and are folded by staff
    It's essentially one piece of a4 paper folded so they weigh nothing.
    The point is her mindset of she is the most important, she knows right, and sticking her now into everything.
    If you stick your nose into everything, it means you are a know all and arrogantly think you know better, and that annoys me big time

    Safety is not the issue here. As on the same shelf next to it there are heavier items stacked the same height,

    Yesterday, on my lunch break I said to her, "just going to the other shop to pick up something, then going to super market to buy bottled water for stock"

    Her reply "Why don't you get water from the other shop?"

    I don't need some 20yr old kid with less experience, less employment length, in a lower managing position and not related to her job task and responsibility questioning my every move.

    It's ludicrous
     
  19. hobartchic

    hobartchic Well-Known Member

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    No. I don't think that's what she's doing. She asked you a question, you do with it what you like. You do need staff that give a damn.
    If there's a problem here, it's that you need everyone to like you. That won't happen in life, ever. Better give up being a manager too.
    Secondly, your staff are constantly whinging about stuff all and you let them. Tell them to grow up and stop whinging.
    She can't be that bad, or your boss would have fired her. The whinging by adults about another adult they don't like (probably because she's not lazy) is the problem. Time to step up.
    By the way, if a man behaved that way, he wouldn't be a *****, he'd be assertive.
     
  20. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    if I wanted everyone to like me , I would have given into what a 20yr olds every demands,

    and please dont turn this into a gender battle, this so isnt it.

    and yes what else can I do to stop them from whinging,
    ive started off with ignoring them Ie let them rant and get it off their chest
    said you let me worry about it
    said mind your own business
    sat them down and told them, if you have a genuine concern about something, tell me after work with reasons and ill listen

    like I said before , shes great at her job 98% of the time, she was moved out of her previous venue due to not fitting in well

    edit: do you stick your nose into everything, thats not even your business when you are the most junior, youngest, least experienced of the organisation? its important in life to know your position, know who you are and who you are not, what you know, what you dont know!

    six months ago, my boss made a business decision that I thought was ludicrous and wrong, I didnt say anything because 1. hes got more experience than me, 2. hes my boss 3. he didnt ask me,

    he made the decision suddenly and impulsively without my consultation,
    and guess what it turns out it wasnt a terrible decision after all, its not the best decision, but its improved the business.

    I knew my place, I knew my role, i knew my strengths, i knew not to stick my nose in it