Investing in share ... help !!!

Discussion in 'Share Investing Strategies, Theories & Education' started by Kelly88, 3rd Apr, 2019.

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  1. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    When you go to the trading screen, you specify the share you want to buy, how many, and at what price.

    That's about it really.....

    The Y-man
     
  2. ChrisP73

    ChrisP73 Well-Known Member

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    Sharesight.com

    Free for 1 portfolio with up to 10 holdings, basic reporting including performance and tax.
     
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  3. devank

    devank Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure if I'm not doing something correctly. Sharesight doesn't sync with the treading platform to update the records.
    I can't be bothered to update the Sharesight every time I trade.
    Instead, I wipe out existing records and re-import the whole lot again whenever I need to look at my portfolio closely.
    Are there any better ways?
     
  4. willair

    willair Well-Known Member Premium Member

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    I would not worry too much about the accounting part,you will get 2 statements per holding each year ,with the dividend rate-shares held-reinvestment updates everything for your Accountant is on one page,it becomes very simple after a while..
    The hard part is what you buy in the start ,if you focus on return on equity ,and not the trap of earnings per share you will do well..
    Also with CommSec ,you can put low offers for 24 hours rather then a month..imho..
     
  5. oracle

    oracle Well-Known Member

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    What platform are you using to trade? You can configure your platform to forward contract note emails to an email address specific to your account provided by Sharesight and then it will automatically sync.

    Alternatively, you can forward the email yourself. That's what I do. Not sure if that functionality is part of the free account. I have a paid account.

    Cheers
    Oracle.
     
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  6. devank

    devank Well-Known Member

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    I use NABTrade. I tried the email forwarding thing but that didn't work well for me. I didn't think of sending the contract note emails directly.
     
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  7. ChrisP73

    ChrisP73 Well-Known Member

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    I’m with nabtrade. I manually forward contract notes to my sharesight import address. Works perfectly. I haven’t bothered trying to get the emails sent directly from nabtrade as manually forwarding has been easily enough. If I wanted more automation but couldn’t get it to work direct from nabtrade I would just setup a Gmail
    Filter to auto forward.

    What’s not working with the email forwarding for you?
     
  8. Kelly88

    Kelly88 Well-Known Member

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    The shares are getting so high now. It's hard to get in and set a price :(:(:(
     
  9. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    How do you get to that conclusion?

    Shares are (fundamentally) "too high" if you are paying more than the business is worth (same as buying a house right?)

    So first you need to figure out what a company is worth (a share is just part ownership of a company - similar to buying a house with a bunch of other people).

    The issue (and main point of argument/speculation) is that valuing a business is not as easy as valuing a house.... that is why I ask how you know share prices are "so high"


    The Y-man
     
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  10. kimba88

    kimba88 Well-Known Member

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    I'm also trying to start investing in shares. I've tried doing some light reading online.. watched a webinar.. however, i'm still struggling to get my head around things. Does anyone know any books (on audible) i could read? Or even a very simple tutorial on all the jargon. I opened up a commsec account in hope of trying to learn more by doing, but now i've opened it up, it's all a little overwhelming. Any help is appreciated please :)
     
  11. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    It really shouldn't be that hard - true there is a lot of jargon, but the basic premise is this:
    Buying a share is buying part ownership of the business ~ kind of like having multiple owners of a house.

    That's all there is.

    If the business makes money, part of the profits can be "distributed" (given) to the part owners, apportioned by how much of the company they own (based on the number of shares).

    The distribution of profits is called a "dividend".

    So if you ever walked into Woolworths and wanted to own part of the business, you can. You just buy Woolworths shares.

    The price of the shares can vary based on whether people who currently own the shares are willing to let go of it for ~ just like buying/selling a house.

    Unfortunately, unlike houses, you can't get a bank valuation as such (it is much harder to value a business than it is to value a house). So it really is much more up to what you are willing to pay for a share, and what someone is willing to sell it for.

    That's about it really - sorry if you were expecting something more magical and mysterious :)

    The Y-man
     
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  12. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    Ok, here is a really simple example of how I selected the shares I own (NOT a recommendation!!) without going into all that stuff about fundamental or technical analysis, charting etc

    See if it makes sense.

    I bought some NAB shares today.
    I did so because:
    1. NAB (usually) pays $1.98 in dividends every year (this is where you use you Commsec quote/research tab).
    2. Someone was willing to sell the shares for $25.44 at some stage during the day. This means that if I buy a part ownership of NAB, I will get 7.78% per annum income (1.98/25.44)
    3. There ARE risks! For instance what if the company goes bust? Well, last time I looked, NAB was one of the big four, so I figured it is unlikely the government will let them disappear overnight.
    4. With all the APRA stuff happening, they have less likelihood of loans to risky people
    5. I am confident NAB will continue to look for and innovate ways to fleece.... er... make money from ... borrowers. While the dividends may fall slightly (due to fewer home loans etc), there is a fair bit of fat in the current 7.78% yield.
    That's about it really.... as stupid as it sounds (and probably is), that was my analysis, and reasons for buying.

    Let us know if there is any specific jargon doing your head in.

    The Y-man
     
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  13. kimba88

    kimba88 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Y-man.

    I think i more or less get confused by all the abbreviations for the businesses. All the different types of shares.. i've seen the word vangard thrown around quite a few times - i've tried googling but i can't seem to grasp it or not sure how to see it on the commsec app.

    I've heard that with a possible government change coming up, it might be more risky buying shares now - i don't really understand why. I saw something about maybe they will get rid of franking credits - which i understand to be an already taxed dividend?

    What sort of tax implications are there on different types of purchases? I own property. I have a job. So if a share pays a dividend, then does that then increase my income and potentially put me in the next tax bracket? Or if a share does not pay dividends, will it only have tax implications if i sell them?

    I'm looking to have a mix of growth, so i can have a nice nest egg to retire on.. and a small passive income would also be nice.

    I've recently read the barefoot investor which has really pushed me into the decision of purchasing shares. But it was just a matter of getting my head around it all.

    I hope to look back on this post in the future and think how dumb it was.
    If there are anymore recommendations on books i can read to learn how to work shares, that would be great - always keen to learn new things.
     
  14. SatayKing

    SatayKing Well-Known Member

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    I can understand the confusion. Initially it's hard. Bombarded with information and you don't know what the information means or if it's relevant to you or even if it is factual or accurate.

    So sit back, have a brew of your choice and ponder how complicated do you want it to be. Probably 95% of everything you hear or read will turn out to be bulldust for you and your circumstances. So first off keep calm. Try and avoid brain chatter. Then focus on you and what you want.

    Have a look at some companies listed on the share market. Ask yourself if you want to invest directly in those or do you feel it's a bit much for you?

    If it is overwhelming or difficult and you decide against investing directly in shares, especially as you likely have a life other than investing, question whether you would prefer to outsource that process. So look at some products such as Exchange Traded Funds or Listed Investment Companies and see if they suit you. You can get information of the products from the ASX web-site. Decide if you are happy with all your money being in Australian companies or whether you would like some international exposure.

    Simple step by step processes until you get where you are comfortable. Not someone else's comfort level. Yours and yours alone.

    As for future risks they will always be there so why start jumping about trying to avoid something which hasn't happened yet? When or if it does happen adjust according to your thoughts about it.

    Society is complicated so why add to the complications if you don't have to by stressing over them? As long as you're not dodging sniper fire while looking for breakfast at the rubbish tip you're in a good position.
     
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  15. oracle

    oracle Well-Known Member

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    Might want to also mention $1.98 dividend per share is fully franked. So the yield is more like
    11.12% (1.98 / 0.7) / 25.44. Plenty of fat if you ask me.

    The worst case scenario out there is NAB might have to reduce it's dividends to 180 cents per share from 198 cents per share (10% reduction) to maintain their capital requirements and re-invest in business to grow.

    Cheers,
    Oracle.
     
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  16. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    Valid point.

    Like the real estate market, there are all sorts of stuff for traded on the australian stock exchange (ASX).

    If you were to look at the property market, there is residential houses, apartments, OTP, rooming accommodation, granny flats, office blocks, warehouses, medical centres, factories, hotels.... the list goes on.

    Similarly the share market has traded on it ordinary shares, listed investment companies (LICs), exchange traded funds (ETFs), realestate investment trusts (REITs) amongst others.

    For the moment treat ETFs and LICs as "fund managers" (just like your super fund manager). They take the your money (just like when you put money in super) and select and buy shares they think will do well. (@Nodrog and others will kill me for this totally oversimplified drivel).

    As for Vanguard, it is just another fund manager (Low-cost managed funds and ETFs)

    You can invest into their funds directly without going through the share market, or you can choose one of the ETFs (basically it's just a different way of skinning the cat - poor cat).
    Low-cost managed funds | ETFs

    Many people like to go with LICs and ETFs because it saves them doing their own research on which if the hundreds of companies to buy into.
    .
    Interesting side note: Do you have super? If you do, I bet some of your money is already in the share market! Most people don't realise this. Now the harder question - do you know exactly which shares your fund manager has put your money into?


    Similar to the "what will happen to negative gearing" argument.
    My suggestion is to worry about it when you get there (well actually let your accountant worry about it at tax time) for now.

    Like property, there are some tax implications, but it is nowhere near as "set" as setting up the wrong sort of loan, having no offset etc. One good thing with shares is that it is very liquid.


    Yes, you own part of a business.
    If you get a share of the profits, it's income and you pay tax on it,
    If you sell the shares for more than you paid, you pay CGT.

    HOWEVER - Goes back to the old argument - is it bad to pay tax because you have made money?
    It's like saying you are offered a pay rise at work and you refuse it because it will put you in the next tax bracket (I have actually had some staff like this at work - they didn't want a pay rise because they would lose some family benefit allowances...)

    Start small, and do what you are doing now - ask questions along the way.
    Again, no different to property - fortunately the outlay is smaller, and so is the risk in that aspect.

    You'll look back and be glad... and think it was foolish you didn't ask more questions....

    Books - I can't think of any at the moment. Centrelink / FIS run some really good FREE introductory seminars - well worth going to for beginners:

    upload_2019-4-30_11-41-22.png


    Financial Information Service - New South Wales - Australian Government Department of Human Services

    The Y-man
     
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  17. kimba88

    kimba88 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for all your help guys! Your information is great and helping to clear things up!

    Now, this may sound really dumb. If i wanted to go through a LIC like AFIC (what the barefoot investor recommends).. can LICS and ETF's not be purchased on commsec? I can't seem to find it on the app. I was hoping to be able to view all my purchases on the commsec app (when i make a purchase).

    Yes, i do have a Super account. It's with HESTA. I was trying to compare them with Hostplus - Choiceplus investment option (what the barefoot investor recommends). It seemed they were quite similar from what i could see. HESTA does not allow me to choose what exact shares i invest my super in, etc, but i can select percentages of asset classes myself.

    Those seminars look great - i wish i was available for the one in Campbelltown tonight.. but i had to work late. I'm not sure i'd make the Dee Why one either. Do they run often?
     
  18. JetstreamVic

    JetstreamVic Well-Known Member

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    I thought I heard a rumor that they will be announcing (maybe today) a dividend cut?

    Maybe a reason why the cheap price
     
  19. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    Their ASX code is "AFI"

    So in commsec, go to the quotes and research tab, aand key in AFI for todays prices, etc


    I think at least once a year if not more often.

    The Y-man
     
  20. kimba88

    kimba88 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Y-man. I'll check it out.

    Also, i just found these online videos on the asx website which i think also helps clear up some info. So for real beginners like me, check them out
    ASX has created a series of audio visual presentations to help you understand various sharemarket topics. They run for a few minutes each and look at the fundamentals of the market and the role of each market participant.

    I've also seen these online courses which i think might help nail the info in.. so i'll probably start doing those tomorrow
    Access to ASX FREE online courses. Work through comprehensive investment material at your own pace. Whether you are a beginner or a more advanced investor there is a class to suit you. A series of interactive exercises will aid your learning and a quiz at the end of each section will assess your progress.