Germany - Kitchens

Discussion in 'The Buying & Selling Process' started by [email protected], 28th Feb, 2019.

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  1. Paul@PFI

    [email protected] Tax Accounting + SMSF Business Plus Member

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    Thought I would share a issue I encountered in Germany. It didnt affect us but could have. Lawyer (notar) explained it all in the contract review which they must provide to be valid. Uncertified contracts arent acceptable to vendors it seems.

    1. The lawyer will do more than "exchange". They actually act as your attorney and will sign the contract. Owners arent allowed to sign a contract !! They will also put a hold on the title to stop gazumping or fraud. Its a standard process. After all you are paying a deposit !!

    This process does help protect buyers and sellers since it means the notar is liable if title doesnt occur.

    Thank god they do this (and give advice) as the next part will indicate a common issue that the rest of the world consider very strange.......


    2. When you rent an apartment to a tenant it may not include a kitchen. Yep thats right. There may be a room for a kitchen but its just that - A empty room. No joke. The former tenant will likely take the cabinets, appliances, benchtops. Often they leave a sink but not always. Maybe some old cabinets or a cupboard or maybe not. Depends if the contract is silent or mentions whats included.

    There is a even a specialised shop for buying kitchens called Kuchen Treff. (And Ikea). What a pain in the bum. Why ?? Apparently its more a OCD - fetish thing about hygiene. But they dont take their toilet !! When I said that to the lawyer he seemed stunned by that view - why would you take a toilet ?? No...why would you take your kitchen !!

    And when your tenant leaves they will take their kitchen and leave the issue for the next tenant. So you may imagine moving property is not a common issue for many germans who rent. :eek:

    And it can take a month or so to get your kitchen delivered AND installed. Tiling, plumbing, gas connection etc.....

    And if you try to let a apartment with a kitchen it can take longer. Because the whole country expects a brand new kitchen !! And wont want your used kitchen.

    and that follows to :

    3. When you buy an apartment or house it may not include a kitchen either. Yes you can contract to leave it included but not many do this. Seems the whole nation are quite happy with the concept of removing a kitchen and taking it even if it wont fit where they are going. And when you buy you need to fluff about to buy ad have your new kitchen installed.

    Absolutely bonkers. (The seller of our place was pleased we wanted the 3 kitchens ....included and thought it may be a concern since they didnt need the kitchens. )
     
    Last edited: 28th Feb, 2019
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  2. Otie

    Otie Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like a great place to be in the Kitchen installation industry!
     
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  3. KinG3o0o

    KinG3o0o Well-Known Member

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    maybe slightly off topic,

    but i found australia pretty rare that you buy a house/unit here brand new comes with "fittings and kitchen + dryer and aircond.

    in asia most i've purchased literally you buy a shell, then your renovate.

    if you want those fittings its an optional extra "if" its offered. not commonly offered.

    and dont 50% german rent ?

    also europe have 10 year lease, so i guess its okay ? to have your own kitchens etc etc
     
  4. Scott No Mates

    Scott No Mates Well-Known Member

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    That's pretty similar to other places in Europe @[email protected] - I recall some of those sea-changer shows for people moving from UK to Spain and other places that they are literally getting a shell and left to their own devices to fitout.

    The longer lease term & with prices are nowhere near what we're used to so it makes viable to install your own.
     
  5. The Y-man

    The Y-man Moderator Staff Member

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    Much closer to a commercial prop here in Oz. You don't necessarily find the kitchenette in one piece and operational.... nor the HVAC sometimes....

    The Y-man
     
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  6. SatayKing

    SatayKing Well-Known Member

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    The cultural aspect can also work in reverse. Was informed of a European couple who migrated here and brought some rather expensive light fittings and curtains with them. When they sold their home to relocate elsewhere they were not aware those fittings were part of the sale. Otherwise it would have been "cheap and cheerful" replacements for the sale. No idea if their first home here was a bare shell or not which could have given them a clue.
     
  7. Paul@PFI

    [email protected] Tax Accounting + SMSF Business Plus Member

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    More - Ownership is around 40%.

    In German a two year initial lease is pretty normal. There after annual or two years. Nobody wants super long term stuff. Share house/apt are really common for younger people.

    From what I can gather germans have a rate of non-kitchen property that is around double that of others who also do it like spain and italy where is around 1/3rd of property.

    Goes to show the assumptions we all make
     
  8. Paul@PFI

    [email protected] Tax Accounting + SMSF Business Plus Member

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    Yes, And the fitout and restoration.
     
  9. Marg4000

    Marg4000 Well-Known Member

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    Pretty common in Germany.

    Workmate moved there for three years. Rented an apartment, which came without a kitchen. They were told they had to install their own, and remove it when they left!

    They bought a second hand kitchen and had it installed. Just before they left, they on-sold it to others.

    There was something about repainting also, but I can’t remember details. From memory, if your tenancy exceeded a certain time, you had to repaint internally when you left.
    Marg
     
  10. KinG3o0o

    KinG3o0o Well-Known Member

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    100%

    my mate in italy renovated the whole house when he moved in..lol
     
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  11. obiuquido144

    obiuquido144 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah in Germany for most people in city apartments "the kitchen" comprises of a cheap-as table, sometimes with a sink, and a non-integrated cooker. It's interesting in contrast with the Australian dream of starship enterprise kitchens/galleries, with often a 2nd kitchen hiding behind the show one.

    Another German oddity, which I find quite clever, is that all bathtubs I've seen had the long wall facing the room angled in (bottom is approx 15cm pushed in), presumably to allow room for feet and toes when standing or walking around it.
     
  12. Casteller

    Casteller Well-Known Member

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    I'm into my second 4 year lease in Spain. There were no light fittings when I moved in, just wires. No toilet seat either, but there was a kitchen. No fridge or oven though.

    Rented in Switzerland for 10 years, it had everything, including a kitchen in a cupboard which I used to challenge visitors to find. Some odd rules though, that seemed normal by the time I left.

    I like the security of tenure of renting in continental Europe.
     
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  13. Paul@PFI

    [email protected] Tax Accounting + SMSF Business Plus Member

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    I get you with the Swiss / germans. We were asked to consider buying with kitchens and EVERY fixture, fitting and contents. They jumped when we said yes (For 3 x short stay use as it was also for prior owner). The legal process was interesting but very detailed. It came up when the lawyer started to mention the kitchen issue and he explained it was very unusual we were very fortunate. They basically gave us the interiors and contents for nothing as it would cost them a bit to repaint and then dispose of things. Their problem solved our problem