Chris Gray ?

Discussion in 'Property Experts' started by hillsguy, 27th Aug, 2018.

Join Australia's most dynamic and respected property investment community
Tags:
  1. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
  2. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Wow - given how big (or perhaps not so much) Chris Grey is I am surprised there has not been 1 reply to this thread ...
     
  3. SouthBoy

    SouthBoy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    20th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    255
    Location:
    Ozland
    I have watched Chris Gray on Sky Business over many years, and I always had the impression he had a penchant for accumulating apartments, in eastern suburbs of Sydney. Never heard him talk about other cities and definitely didn't know he was buying properties in other cities.
     
  4. euro73

    euro73 Well-Known Member Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    6,125
    Location:
    The beautiful Hills District, Sydney Australia
    Like many of the members here who have achieved only modest success - say 4,5,6 properties - but have then marketed themselves as being far more accomplished and knowledgeable than they actually are and gone on to set up mortgage businesses or BA businesses.... Chris Gray is well overrated and his successes have been built on a complete reliance on credit expansion.

    Now that his Living On Equity approach to property has been completely disrupted by the APRA era, its unsurprising he is using his TV profile to build a business as a BA. I guess like everyone else, he is finding that he actually needs some cash flow - equity doesn't pay the bills.


    Interestingly, a good number of his BA "team" appear to have their own businesses already . Are they Your Empire BA's, or are they contractors doing work for him on the side?


    This guy is apparently the Brisbane rep for "Your Empire"... or is he just moonlighting from his main gig? Zoran Solano - Investment Property Buyers Agent | Hot Property Buyers Agency | Hot Property Buyers Agency

    Looks like Chris and his sidekick Luis also work for "hotproperty" as well as "Your Empire" ...so maybe its the other way around...
    Chris Gray | Hot Property Buyers Agency

    Luis Lequerica | Hot Property Buyers Agency


    This lady is the Melbourne rep... or is she ? Buyers Advocates Melbourne | Vendors Advocate


    Almost without exception, these "guru's" end up being a big fat disappointment when you get past the marketing... Lomas. Birch. Gray. Hoskins.....

    And it just goes to prove what I have been saying for years now - APRA catches up to everyone who hasnt paid attention to cash flow and debt reduction.
     
    gty12, HapppyChat and leonard157 like this.
  5. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Wow - nice post euro73.

    I actually spoke with Luis yesterday ... asking few questions and he tells me that the course works ! He personally has $100 Million in property and 'trust me' it works.

    If this is not alarm bells ringing ... I don't know what is !

    Agree that equity does not pay the bills ... I have been thinking a lot about Chris' approach and difficult to see how his model is sustainable over long periods of little / negative growth.

    Would a line of credit not overcome the issues with APRA and I/O periods ?
     
  6. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    8,130
    Location:
    03 9877 3000
    How is it you think a LOC would actually overcome borrowing limitations?

    A line of credit is just another loan. It reduces your borrowing capacity just like any other loan (in fact by more because the rates are quite high).
     
  7. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
    A LOC removes the 5 year I/O period does it not ?
     
  8. kierank

    kierank Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    20th Jan, 2016
    Posts:
    8,414
    Location:
    Gold Coast
    I think you will find the Living-on-Equity road covered in dead bodies ;).
     
  9. euro73

    euro73 Well-Known Member Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    6,125
    Location:
    The beautiful Hills District, Sydney Australia
    The old days of the "evergreen" LOC are over.... With those types of products the credit limit remained the same for the life of the loan – whether 25 or 30 years – without the requirement to pay them down by making reductions in principle. When the NCCP was introduced this product basically became extinct because it was deemed by the legislators to be impossible to prove at the start of the loan that a borrower could afford to pay the full loan amount in one go at the end of the term of the loan. Most Lines of Credit ( the very few that are still around) now run an interest only term for 5 or 10 years ( 5 years is the standard since the IO quota was introduced) followed by required Principle and interest payments for the remainder of the term. So they are no different to regular variable rate loans in that regard, rendering the entire LOC concept redundant. I dont know why lenders call them LOC's... they are not. Worse still, they charge moe for these products. Crazy.

    In very plain terms, a variable rate with a transactional offset account and 5 or 10 years IO offers EXACTLY the same functionality as the post GFC/post NCCP LOC with 5 or 10 years IO, but at a cheaper rate.

    LOC's are redundant.
    LOE strategies are redundant.
    Speculative approaches to resi property are redundant


    Don't know how long its going to take for investors to realise these old business models run by these "guru's" are not the way to do things moving forward..it's all about cash flow and debt reduction and holding power now. If the changed credit environment hasnt made that clear to any reader by now, they should seriously reconsider whether they have any business being in this business we call property investing.
     
    Last edited: 29th Aug, 2018
  10. euro73

    euro73 Well-Known Member Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    6,125
    Location:
    The beautiful Hills District, Sydney Australia
    Wow. Even Chris Gray only claims to have a $15 Million Portfolio.... Wonder why Luis works for Chris, rather than the other way around? Actually... why does Luis work at all with $100 Million? I think he may have embellished just a touch. No one - and I mean no one - can access the volume of resi lending required to own and hold a $100 million resi portfolio....

    How do these people get TV shows? Did anyone ever watch Chris Gray's show and listen to the drivel they talked about on that show? As an aside- Sky had Birch and Zoran on last night talking up capital growth and brushing off APRA..... more nonsense. If I didn't know better I'd say Birch has a learning disorder. He cannot string even one cohesive sentence together.
     
    Last edited: 29th Aug, 2018
    Codie likes this.
  11. Oliver

    Oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    16th Feb, 2017
    Posts:
    96
    Location:
    Melbourne
    I met Chris and Luis a few months ago.

    They came with their Lamborgini and were a bit showing off their success...I suspect it may work for some people that would want to get rich as well.
    They advised me they were focusing on the eastern beaches of Sydney and that this area would never go wrong. And again, it was just at the end of the boom in Sydney.

    I'm glad I didn't buy anything.
     
  12. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
    Phew! Glad this thread is alive.

    I needed to have some of my thinking validated from others here.

    So if LOE is dead I wonder what the next magic pill will be ?
     
  13. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    8,130
    Location:
    03 9877 3000
    Saving money and paying off debt...

    ...but people don't want to hear that, too much hard work.
     
    Brady, Ian87, Sackie and 4 others like this.
  14. Tonibell

    Tonibell Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    1,107
    Location:
    Sydney
    Selling and living off the cash ?
    If you have equity then there are options.

    His Foxtel show was the most entertaining of them all - particularly Charles Tarby’s segment.
     
  15. Player

    Player Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    1,097
    Location:
    Paradiso
    Most people have selective deafness when the process isn't sexy.

    Success lies on the other side.............. of work!
     
    Sackie and Jacque like this.
  16. euro73

    euro73 Well-Known Member Business Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    6,125
    Location:
    The beautiful Hills District, Sydney Australia
    cash cow 4.jpeg Pay-Off-Debt-Button-691x691.jpg Mortgage Free man 2 .png leprehcaun.jpg einstein .jpg
     
    leonard157 likes this.
  17. beachgurl

    beachgurl Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    18th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    1,318
    Location:
    Sydney
    Subletting rent by the room
     
  18. Rolf Latham

    Rolf Latham Inciteful (sic) Staff Member Business Plus Member

    Joined:
    14th Jun, 2015
    Posts:
    10,598
    Location:
    Gold Coast (Australia Wide)
    2 bunks per room ?

    Ta

    Rolf
     
    leonard157 likes this.
  19. Lacrim

    Lacrim Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Jul, 2015
    Posts:
    6,175
    Location:
    Australia
    Thinking about it..unless things improve from a lending point of view, perhaps Peter T's recommendation is the way to go ie buy a PPOR, draw on equity when you can and purchase LICs and/or get a modest margin loan going.
     
  20. hillsguy

    hillsguy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    25th Aug, 2015
    Posts:
    499
    Location:
    Adelaide
    We should start working a course Lacrim !