Can you really help people who can not manage MONEY?

Discussion in 'Money Management & Banking' started by MTR, 14th Jan, 2016.

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  1. Aconis

    Aconis Well-Known Member

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    It is sad when its a relative in this position. You want to help family especially, but sometimes its safer not to.
     
  2. neK

    neK Well-Known Member

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    Had the same thing....been in the same industry.. No one wants to ask, everyone seems too ashamed - its as if they think the appearance they are putting up will crumble if they reveal the truth.... what they don't realise is that its already evident hence why the offer to help was put forward.

    I've been trying to help my mate for years, but realised a while back you can't force it. A bit like the saying "when the student is ready, the teacher will appear".... the teacher has been there the whole time, they've just been waiting patiently because they know it can't be forced.

    For immediate family, i do try and help, yes they don't like me for it, but at the same time they appreciate it (eg. Question some of their spending habits or large dollar value items, or asking why they missed their loan repayment etc). Its a lose lose situation for me, but it would be a bigger loss if i stood around and did nothing and watch how their inability to put 1 and 1 together would impact me and my wife further down the track. Friends come and go, but blood is blood.
     
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  3. JacM

    JacM VIC Buyer's Agent - Melbourne, Geelong, Ballarat Business Member

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    I have found that in some cases yes, you can help. However if you try to have people change many things at once, it won't work. If you tackle things one at a time, allow the new behaviour become part of the person's new normal routine, it can work. It allows them to see that the new behaviours are not difficult and scary, and it gives them a calm environment without too much change at once to clearly see how each change is helping them financially and making things easier for them.
     
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  4. tobe

    tobe Well-Known Member

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    Its a shame financial planning isn't more about personal finances, rather than insurance and investing. If they started with personal finances there would be more people in front of planners I reckon.
    I guess there are financial councillors, but they are pretty thin on the ground, and usually only available for the most dire cases.
     
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  5. neK

    neK Well-Known Member

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    Why would it be? Budgeting doesn't make the banks any money, it would probably result in loss of revenue in personal loans and credit cards!
    None of the DFP subjects cover budgeting or the concept of delayed gratification.
    Hell, its not even taught in schools.
    Its very easy to say "spend less". A lot harder to figure out how to do it.
     
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  6. Mombius Hibachi

    Mombius Hibachi Well-Known Member

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    No there wouldn't.
     
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  7. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    It must be possible, otherwise those annoying ads for "My Budget" wouldn't keep appearing on my teev.

    But; from personal experience of offering the odd bit of advice etc; most times folks don't take up the advice and run with it.
     
  8. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    I find it easy; I never go shopping.
     
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  9. Mombius Hibachi

    Mombius Hibachi Well-Known Member

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    The biggest issue I see in this thread is people offering unsolicited advice. You know what my reaction to people who offer me unsolicited advice is?

    [​IMG]

    The people I've spoken to have approached me and asked me what I thought. I then give them a few tips and tell them I'm happy to help, if they want it. Then leave it up to them.

    I know human nature dictates that we like to toot our own horns and everyone on the forum is a financial genius, but just give it a rest, dudes. No one wants to hear it, for real.
     
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  10. neK

    neK Well-Known Member

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    I'm pretty sure those are just debt consolidation / payment payment negotiation services.
    Not sure how paying a fee to get you out of debt is a good start... its like financial planners charging you a $5k fee to start a regular savings plan. It will take several years just to recoup that.

    I think it needs to be implemented into the school curriculum.....

    If you look at the MyBudget site, its all about get of debt... i don't see where it says "Saving to buy a house, we'll show you how to budget to achieve this"
     
    Last edited: 14th Jan, 2016
  11. Bayview

    Bayview Well-Known Member

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    Not unsolicited per se - just general discussion about a money situation, and I put in my 2c to that discussion....one on one though.
     
  12. neK

    neK Well-Known Member

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    I'm the same, but only after a period of time you might realise how right that person was.
    I try to be more open (or cynical) and listen to what they say and dissect the crap out of it to see how i can utilise it better.
     
  13. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but I don't. My uncle and aunty had no concept of finance and money. Lifelong renters/big time spenders. My uncle loved to buy a new car every couple of years. Not cheap ones. He was the principal of a primary school and 'borrowed' some money to cover some payments. He got caught before he could pay the money back and was fired. I deep debt they got a loan consolidation with a honeymoon interest rate. After the rate got jacked up to the normal level they were in even more trouble. My sister and her husband bailed them out. After some time they asked my aunty for some interest to cover the loan. My aunty was upset at the suggestion. My parents had to loan money to my sister and her husband to cover work they were doing. Then later, I got a call from my parents needing $100k in 3 days or they would not be able to settle a property they bought.

    These thing snowball. It is bad news. Many years later after much financial hardship and nearly losing their house, my aunty and uncle reformed somewhat, paid back the money they owed and started investing in property. As far as I know, no one "helped' them figure it all out. I think that is something they had to do on their own.
     
  14. Peter_Tersteeg

    Peter_Tersteeg Mortgage Broker Business Member

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    A few years ago a client asked me to top up their mortgage so they'd have enough money for a trip to Europe so they could visit Mum in Spain. They only wanted $5k for the flights, the planned trip was 12 months away and I'd already done a debt consolidation to pay off some cards earlier that year.

    When asking about their cash flow, they suggested that affording the increase would be easy so I asked if they had an extra $100 a week in their budget. Sure, no problem.

    I suggested they save $100 a week into a separate bank account to pay for the trip.

    18 months later, they hadn't gone on the trip and they needed me to consolidate the credit cards that were getting out of control and was hurting their cash flow. FML.
     
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  15. MTR

    MTR Well-Known Member

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    So sounds like they got their act together and all good now??
     
  16. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    I would say much better but not all good. At least they have some concept of finance and money now. I suspect the low interest rates are helping them at the moment. I am concerned about when interest rates go up though.
     
  17. Perthguy

    Perthguy Well-Known Member

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    It's for the people who are so bad with money they can't even pay their bills. So they pay someone to pay their bills. o_O

    Basically, your salary goes to these people, they pay your bills and give you a certain amount. You pay them to do this. I can't comprehend any of this. It seems the person using the service wouldn't really learn to reform their ways. To me, it's just giving a man a fish.

    Money Magazine did a write up on this service a while back and concluded:

    If you are already in financial trouble, it doesn’t make sense to take on additional costs to have your bills looked after. You can deal with your debt yourself by cutting up credit cards and taking out a personal loan to lower the interest pain. If you are totally hopeless with your money, ignore your bills and don’t have the will to tackle the problem, then MyBudget can help you get your finances on track, but you also have to be prepared to do the hard yards and cut back on spending and leave the credit card at home more often. MyBudget alone won’t solve your financial problems.

    Are budgeting specialist the answer? - Money magazine
     
  18. hammer

    hammer Well-Known Member

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    If they come to you...then maybe.

    If you go to them... Forget it.

    They've got to make the first move and "want it". Without that carrot it just doesn't work.

    This is my experience coming from a low socio-economic family.

    My family is actually happier broke....
     
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  19. Ozzie in Texas

    Ozzie in Texas Well-Known Member

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    I came home from work stressed because of this very issue.

    My employers, bless their hearts, have absolutely no clue how to manage their money. They have lived great lives living off royalties from booming oil/energy prices. We talk about cost cutting and budgeting......and just when I think we've reached an agreement, they double salaries to their favoured consultants or blow money on a crazy investment with high risk/low capital returns. And meanwhile, are clueless or want to be clueless, to the fact that their savings/equity is quickly disappearing.

    They can't be saved. You have to want it and see it and know it. Those who live with their heads buried in the sand, will eventually be swallowed by the said sand.
     
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  20. TMNT

    TMNT Well-Known Member

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    as TerryW said it best, you cant help someone who doesnt want to be helped or refuses to admit, you have to change within

    the only problem is any one interefering will be seen as interfering

    unless they are literally going kill themselves by their spending habits, the only thing you can do is let them sort it out, its their choice, they are adults, their responsbility,

    probably do more damage by interfering/offering advice/guiding them/recommending/suggesting or whatever you call it

    or a neutral letter describing your fears and then to give it to them when everyone is calm
     
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