Bypassing agent

So i had a look at an off market property though a real estate agent....i was keen on property and subsequently submitted offer which was accepted. However, the sellers delayed due to issue getting their own finance and contracts were never signed despite being drawn up and submitted to conveyancer. Weeks past without any furthur progression and poor communication from agent till the point i approached seller. We spoke and both agree we could make the deal between ourselves if able...we both can save some money and agent isnt the best....can we do a private sale between owner and seller legally? and without commission charges oweing to original agent? Any other issues with this? The seller did sign a document (not believed to be a contract for selling) with agent prior to showing me through.

 

What is your agreement with the agent?

 

I have no formal arrangement with agent....he is not acting as my buyers agent or anything...i told him the sort of house i wanted after inspecting another house with him and he called back a few days later and mentioned this one. I inspected with him and as i said above..offered and contracts were drawn up but not signed...only given to conveyancer to look over.

 

• Is the selling agent the managing agent? There may be a commission payable regardless.
• What has the vendor signed with the agent? Was these a time limit? Is the vendor still bound?

 

Well its am off market property..no contract of sale was made by the sellers with the agent apparently. Im not sure what the document he had the seller sign prior to showing us through but apparently it wasnt a contract with agent. The seller hasnt exactly said what the document was? Any ideas?

 

No you cannot... clearly... the seller did not sign so the seller did not accept. Sign = deal. No sign = No deal as far as im concerned. (I'm sure many would disagree but so be it)

Why you trying to be weird and cut corners when you don't know what you're doing?

 

The seller should have signed a listing authority with the agent. There's no such thing as "off market" in this case. If the agent is acting on their behalf and facilitating the sale of the property, then it's "on the market". Get a copy of the listing authority, it will contain precisely what obligations the seller has regarding the commission payable and the terms etc.

 

If you found the property through the agent & you now have gone and worked things out between yourselves, the agent could probably argue you were introduced by them & some commission is payable.

If I were you, I would tell the agent your buying direct & see what they say, if they did not have it legally to sell, there may not be anything much they can do as it would reveal they were not acting correctly either.

If you do not want to talk to them, just have the solicitors look at it all and talk to them if any question.

 

Sorry meant to say the vendor and the agent

 

Well im trying to get the property.....as i said to seller i dont care if we go through agent or not (i assume your an agent? Lol) . If him saving 10k commission encourages the sale to happen and a potential price reduction for me also well why wouldnt you investigate that option...its not exactly a difficult process to do a private sale.....it was more potential issues around the idea. Basically im doing the sellers research.

 

Yeh i guess the big question is what was the document seller signed ....i will try and find out. I will also call the conveyancer who i dealt with for advice. Just trying to get the house haha...

 

I have no formal agreement with either. Other than inspecting/ submitting offer via agent. I spoke to seller directly in an attempt encourage the sale and just gave him the option of private sale (if it all works/legal)...at the end of the day it will be seller responsable for any "owed" commission but depends on what arrangement is with seller/agent if there is any payable from what i understand

 

The issue will be with the vendor and their agent. The agent agreement may (and usually does) specify a sale within XXX days/ months after the agency agreement ends arising from parties introduced by the agent during the agency period remains liable for fees....If they have your details it may be caught. Agencies generally aggressively assert their rights to income when their client is dishonest or in breach. They do monitor local sales for the issue too. You arent the first person to do this.

The conveyancer cant give legal advice if they arent a solicitor. Its a question re contract law and liability.

 

Generally speaking the agent will still be owed a commission here, assuming there was a legal agency agreement in place. As you were introduced to the property by the agent, negotiated a sale on the property and had contracts issued it would be hard to argue otherwise. This problem however lies with the vendor and not yourself.

 

The vendors solicitor will ask you if an agent at all was involved or any other agent, the key is, was there a legal agreement to start with.

I know what I would do.

 

Continue with the agent i assume? Yeh im thinking suggesting same to the vendor.

 

just ask agent if they expect payment and how much, if there was no agreement in place or was not legit listing, they may not push for this, it is really the vendors issue anyway.

 

Ok. So i finally found out it was a form 6 /appointment of agent form that the vendor signed....
Is there a time frame once this agreement has finalised that would nullify the agents claim to commission? The whole deal is dragging on while vendor gets his own finances sorted and shops for another house to buy himself...might be a while before we can get a deal confirmed...

 

All that information should be on the appointment to act documentation.

 

Form 6 states
" When you don’t have to pay the agent

1. 
   • If the client sells the property privately and the agent is not the effective cause of sale i.e.: purchaser did not contact the agent, did not attend open house inspections etc. "

You state in your original post
"So i had a look at an off market property though a real estate agent"

My take on this is that the agent is the effective cause of the sale so if the agent finds out then they will charge the seller commission.

This is not a problem for you provided you do not indemnify the seller against agent commissions, i.e. You promise that you were not introduced by an agent.

In NSW when selling my solicitor always adds a special clause that would indemnify me (the seller) from being hit with additional commissions if another can show they introduced the buyer to the property.