Precious Metals 17% return on my gold purchase from Perth Mint

Physical Gold has it's place as a hedge and a store of wealth but I limit it to about 5% of asset allocation and hope that I never need it.

You cant live in it, it provides no income and is about as much use as a bag of rocks.

If the value of your gold is going up, the value of other assets is probably going down. I'd much rather my gold be worthless.

Willy

 

But surely Bitcoin is starting to show its more than a bubble. I’m not saying to invest in it, nor am I saying it’s currently a reliable store of wealth but I wouldn’t be so quick to dismiss its long term potential.

I don’t believe the technology of Bitcoin will ever be adopted as an everyday currency but I am slowly starting to believe that it will in fact become a store of wealth.

To get to this point we need stable and governed cryptocurrencies to become the norm but that IMO is 100% inevitable.

 

Bitcoin has many benefits:

- its free from human political intervention (big plus),
- its permissionless, censorship resistant,
- has a finite supply, is secure, and recorded on an open ledger,
- its borderless and with very low transaction fees, so its utility is sending currency to anyone in the world at a low fee and cutting out the banks.

There's no other asset class like it, and because its such a new technology it's still in a price discovery phase...

Now consider these two points:

- there's a 50% chance its worth nothing... but there's also a 50% chance it may be worth something... we don't know its true value as it is an emerging technology. With so much potential upside and limited downside, its an asymmetrical bet worth taking...

- the Winklevoss twins saw bitcoin's potential value, and have poured millions of dollars into purchasing bitcoin back in 2013. Their portfolio is now worth over a billion dollars. Clearly they've seen something that you might not have... Don't be so closed-minded that you don't see the forest from the trees...

 

Are you serious? Bitcoin is THE best performing asset BY FAR over the last 10 years than any other asset. O

So an asset goes from .01c to $20,000 then “crashes” down to $10,000 and your like “see, I told you it was going to crash”

 

There has lots of political intervention and the hodlers are begging for more.

Finite supply means nothing

It failed as a currency when it stared gaining popularity. Slow, clunky and expensive.
The whole micro transaction BS was exposed for what it was, a load of BS.
And the banks were often involved. Again the bc crowd always cheered at any hint of bank acceptance, not to mention XRP riding on it's so called bank connections.

And it's not as anonymous as it used to be and soon will be much less again. Which is really another failure of it's initial premise.

There are hundreds of cryptos many with better tech than BC. They don't have the big money push that BC has.

Bitcoin is the most profitable Ponzi scheme in history ever!
And that makes it also the biggest scam ever seen in history.

The latest crypto scam
Irish cryptocurrency exchange worth millions 'vanishes' in international scam

 

Well seems like you've already made up your mind... Guess you are absolutely right... Just a big tulip bulb ponzi...

Lets revisit this post in 12-24 months...

 

Finite supply means everything. For not only investors but everyday citizens. It means bitcoin is a deflationary asset that rewards accumulation and won't devalue over time through an increasing supply. Fiat currency on the other hand, is inflationary, and does have an increasing supply which is determined by the government, which as you know devalues with time. Just ask your grandparents about what the price of milk was back in the 80s and compare it to the price now.

Bitcoin, at only 10 years old, is still very early in its lifespan, and already you're judging it has failed as a currency. How about we give it until its at least 20 years established before you pass your harsh judgement?

In fact bitcoin's primary utility likely isn't meant to usurp fiat currency. Perhaps its utility is more a store of value, akin to digital gold. An asset to hedge against currency manipulation.

I don't know if you've been doing your research lately, but bitcoin is not slow, clunky or expensive anymore. As it is constantly evolving, the layer 2 tech with the Lightning Network, has made transaction times much faster (< 1 minute average) and the fees have drastically reduced as well.

And why would you want bitcoin to have the best tech right now? As the market leader in the space, with 10x more capitalisation than its nearest competitior ethereum, wouldn't you want to see what tech works and what tech doesnt before implementing it. If bitcoin is the turtle, and the alt coins are the hare, and the race is 20 years long, I think a more measured approach to implementing new tech would win over the longer-term.

There will always be naysayers harshly criticising new technology. In spite of what you think, your voice isn't unique. The same voices were saying in the 90s that the internet was doomed. Speeds were too slow and clunky with dial-up modems and service providers were too expensive. Only used to buy drugs, excite porn-users, and spread mass ponzi and conman schemes through emails and dating sites.

We should have banned mobile phones and cash too because telemarketing scams are so rife, they've ripped off thousands of Australians. Just ask Dan from MAFS.

Its really a testament to the strength of bitcoin that its survived over 10 years in the face of such harsh criticism. Bitcoin has been proclaimed a scam, ponzi and dead over 370 times now by experts since its inception.

Maybe to find answers as to whether bitcoin is an elaborate tulip bulb ponzi, we should follow the money. Find out where the best and most entrepreneurial are investing their funds.

Yale University has invested hundreds of millions into a crypto fund.

JP Morgan, one of the largest banks in USA, and Facebook are both coming out with their own crypto coins. JP Morgan's coin is already being used for digital payments. While Libra will expose over 2.5 billion Facebook users to the crypto industry.

The Commonwealth Bank has its own blockchain department and are investigating using ethereum for settlements.

Fidelity, the largest asset managers in the world with over $7 trillion in assets are opening their own crypto trading service.

A pity that you would have been completely oblivious to the 300% gains bitcoin has made since the start of 2019. And as someone else pointed out bitcoin has been the best performing asset in the last 10 years which of course you've missed out on. $1 invested in bitcoin in 2011 has yielded a 33000x return to today. Thats to be expected though with such a successful ponzi.

Regardless, lets check-in with your post in 12-24 months so you can proudly confirm that bitcoin was all a big ponzi all along.

 

One of the biggest weaknesses of bitcoin is that its totally reliant on 21st century technology.
Physical gold does not have that problem.
You can even sell it by the gram and trade it for something else..
You dont need access to a power source or internet connectivity and it can be an instant swap.
Physical gold will always have its place.

 

While this is true, if we were to be disconnected from electricity on a long term basis, we would have more serious problems than bitcoin, gold or investments.
But, yes gold will always have its place, no denying that.

 

You can actually transact bitcoin via satellite without the need of the internet. Also, if we are living in a world without electricity then we are living in a Mad Max apocalypse world and have bigger things to be concerned with.

 

Gold has been used for centuries as a backup currency and to trade , nothing has changed.
and you cant change that.
Its very tradable, it can be easily transported, and you can do a straight swap,without much help from 21st century technology.
In many parts of the world with unstable currencies, banks or governments , keeping a bit tucked away is just part of life.
Nothing apocalyptic about it.

 

___________
Nicely written. Couldn't agree with you more

 

And sorry to be so naive but mambo jumbo to some...
All I know is that if I don't understand the investment I won't invest, so I wonder how many truly understand it?
And how many would invest into it not understanding it?
However, I do like my physical gold.

 

Gold also has very little intrinsic value. Sure, it's great for plating electronics contactors, but you don't need a lot of it.
I personally wouldn't buy gold, as it doesn't pay you a return and you're speculating on it going up.

 

No.... many who invest in gold are not speculating on it going up.

They simply realize that cash depreciates through inflation. Fundamental difference.

 

I agree with that, though the title of this thread hints at speculation, not at asset protection.

 

Here is a little facts before you buy gold or any asset that it doesn't generates an income.

if you bought ASX 200 index at the ABSOLUTE top of the market in 2007, you about to comes back even in capital but during that time you have got 60%-70% back in dividend payment

If you bought Gold at the peak of $2000, you way way behind by about 4-5% a year in loss income each year, the long it goes the worse it get, even if it shot to $2500 now you still way way behind.

Still want to buy gold?

 

money is simple, stick to simple rule

any asset that doesn't generates an income is classified as speculation, it doesn't matter if it gold, bitcoin, a block of land sitting there doing nothing.

Your only hope of making the money is someone willing paying a higher price than you while you sit on it, while you sits on it you going backward by 4-5% in loss earning a year, so in order for you to make it a profitable venture, it has to rise more than 4-5% a year.

Now that doesn't mean you cant make money buying gold or bitcoin or block of land
it just doesn't qualified as an investment as it doesn't generates an income and it hard to value as you don't have anything to work on, you can based it on cost of production but again it harder to value as different place has different cost of production for gold, where earning and cash flow it easier to calculate

a business or a properties that throw out free cash flow of 4-5% is easy to calculates on how much it roughly worth than something that generates zero income.